ACCEPTED Complete Crafting Overhaul Remade (by kryptopyr)

[dreadflopp]

Thanks CJ2311, seems you have the answers to all my questions lately

[CJ2311]

No problem. I'm afraid I don't know the answer to the meaning of life, though :(

[dreadflopp]

Life has no meaning a priori… It is up to you to give it a meaning, and value is nothing but the meaning that you choose/Jean-Paul Sartre

Another answer could be 42 :-)

Sorry for off topic...

[Galrick]

Comment/feedback/suggestion:

Would it be possible to have an option that allows us to gain experience from using the Tanning Rack except when turning pelts into leather?

 

The Tanning Rack was designed by Bethesda to be a Smelter for pelts. However, many mods add crafting options to it, making it a Forge for pelts instead.

 

Now, if for some reason I find myself earning too much experience turning ore into ingots, I can turn off the Experience from Smelter option in CCO. That way, I still gain experience from crafting at the Forge but not from smelting. With the Tanning Rack, I "smelt" pelts and "craft" them at the same crafting station. So if I find that I earn too much experience curing leather but still want to gain experience from actual leatherworking, well... too bad - it's an all or nothing option.

[kryptopyr]

No, unfortunately, it's not possible to make the game distinguish between different items created at the same crafting station.  The only way to do this would be to create a new tanning rack with unique keywords, then change ALL of the recipes for either pelts or leather equipment so one set would use the new tanning rack and the other set would use the vanilla tanning rack.  This method would also rely on individual mod authors implementing the same practice in their mods, so consistency between items added by different mods would be spotty at best.

 

Personally, I don't feel that this additional complication is worth doing for the pelts and leather, but it's something I've been considering for jewelry crafting.  One of my plans for CCO is to expand the range of jewelry combinations that are available.  I also want the particular combination of metal and gemstone to have more significance in the game (enchanting being the obvious cross-over).  However, jewelry also tends to level smithing skill relatively quickly compared to other items, so for mages or other non-smith characters to really benefit from a more intricate jewelry enchanting system, there needs to be a way to craft jewelry without also rapidly leveling the smithing skill.  This is one of the features I'm working on for CCO v2. 

[Galrick]

Ah I see. Thanks for the answer Krypto. It's really only an issue when running mods that increase spawn rates like ASIS or SIC.

With those you can fill your backpack with wolf pelts real quick! 

 

An enhanced crafting system for jewelry would be sweet indeed. Crafting is just such an interesting part of this game, it would be nice for all character archetypes to be able to benefit from it.

Since you're around, another question. With Jaysus and Heavy Armory you gave us access to some sweet melee weapons. Have you any plan to integrate ranged weapon mods?

[kryptopyr]

I would like to continue integrating mods into CCO.  This will depend though on several factors.

1) how much time I have available and how much time it would take to include the mod (which means that a large and complex mod with lots of items and leveled list additions will be less likely to be integrated into CCO than a mod that adds only one or two craftable items).

2) permission from the original author of course

3) outside compatibility issues.  One of the reasons that I didn't request permission to integrate WIC and Cloaks is that they are referenced by other mods like Frostfall and Wet & Cold, so including these items in CCO would have made them incompatible with those mods (unless the mods were updated to also include compatibility for CCO).  It seemed easier to just avoid that sort of conflict.

4) new items must be well done and lore-friendly.  However, I'm avoiding including anything that has already been integrated into Immersive Armors and/or Weapons.  Those are incredibly popular compilations, so I feel there is little benefit in duplicating their work.

 

Right now, I have a lot of work to do in updating my other mods and streamlining compatibility among all of them, so CCO V2 may be a ways off yet.  However, the major features I have planned for the update are the expanded jewelry options, a working lunar forge, expanded cooking recipes, and integration of a popular weapons mod that I recently received permission for (don't ask which one, it's a surprise).  ;)

[Noobsayer]

I have a bit of a compatibility question.

 

I read your stuff on keywords. Assuming I add appropriate CCOR, WAF and CCF words, would I then still need to adjust recipes manually to get something that fit within those mods' balance? I want to edit a couple of mods I use outside IA (personal use) to fit, but I'm not sure what all needs to be done exactly.

[kryptopyr]

CCO does not dynamically change recipes for items added by other mods, so if you feel those recipes aren't balanced correctly, then you would need to adjust each recipe manually.

[Noobsayer]

OK great, no biggie. I'm gonna have to add breakdown recipes anyway (that much I knew) so I can do that while I'm at it. Thanks again for your wonderful overhauls -- although they're so well done, it makes the mods that aren't compatible really stick out. :D

[kryptopyr]

I want to give you a heads up before you spend a lot of time adding breakdown recipes and CCO conditions.  I think Mator (https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/49373/?) is just about ready to release several TES5Edit scripts that will automatically create breakdown recipes and add CCO conditions (as well as a few of the WAF keywords) to recipes added by other mods.  He's developed the scripts to be consistent with CCO formulas.  From what I've seen in the test versions, the scripts should really help to make adding CCO compatibility to other mods quick and easy.

[Kelmych]

CCOR seems to have a lot more capabilities, configurability, and integration with other mods than Ars Metallica. About the only small area where Ars Metallica seems to have a liitle more capability is in the number of recipes for melting objects in the smelter to make ingots.

[Noobsayer]

I want to give you a heads up before you spend a lot of time adding breakdown recipes and CCO conditions.  I think Mator (https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/49373/?) is just about ready to release several TES5Edit scripts that will automatically create breakdown recipes and add CCO conditions (as well as a few of the WAF keywords) to recipes added by other mods.  He's developed the scripts to be consistent with CCO formulas.  From what I've seen in the test versions, the scripts should really help to make adding CCO compatibility to other mods quick and easy.

 

Oh man, that's awesome. Thanks for the heads up! :D

[kryptopyr]

About the only small area where Ars Metallica seems to have a liitle more capability is in the number of recipes for melting objects in the smelter to make ingots.

I've come across a few similar comments about Ars Metallica offering more breakdown recipes.  I was curious what CCO was missing, so I went through and compared them.  Since there may be others who are wondering about the difference between these two mods, I figured I'd post my comparison here.  For the record, this is what I found:

 

Breakdown recipes in Ars Metallica that are not included in CCO:

-4 Falmer Helmet/Armor/Boots/Gauntlets

-15 DwarvenBowl02/03, DwarvenPot01, DwarvenUrn01, Dwarven Panx2/Plate/Dish/Cupx3/Fork/Spoon/Knife/bowl

-2 Flagon, diabella statue

-2 SilverPlatterIdle (with Cups & with Food)

-4 Crossbows & Enhanced Crossbows

------- TOTAL 27

 

Breakdown recipes in CCO that are not included in Ars Metallica:

-8 Imperial Shield, Imperial Armor, Imperial Light Shield/Boots/Armor/Bracers/Helmet, Studded Imperial Armor

-5 Hide Boots, Cuirass, Gauntlets, Helmet, Shield

-3 Leather Boots, Bracers, Helmet

-1 Banded Iron Shield

-10 Circlets

-4 gold/silver ring/necklace

-6 Scaled Boots/Bracers/Helmet/Armor, Scaled Armor, Scaled Horn Armor

-2 Wolf Helmet/Armor/Boots/Gauntlets

-3 Ancient Nord Boots/Helmet/Gauntlets

-4 Fur Armor pieces

-10 Lockpicks, gold coins, torture tools, lantern, embalming toolx4/clothes iron/saw

-4 Empty Wine Bottles

-4 Woodcutter's Axe, Dragon Priest Dagger, Scimitar, pickaxe

-10 Ancient Nord weapons & Honed Ancient Nord Weapons

-2 Imperial Bow & Sword

-5 Nord Hero Weapons

-5 Skyforge Steel Weapons

-10 Dawnguard Axe/Boots/Cuirassx4/Gauntlets/Helmet/Hammer/Shield

------- TOTAL 96

 

CCO also includes breakdown recipes for Worn Shrouded armor, Thieves Guild armors, and Summerset Shadows armor.  I didn't count these in the comparison list since the versions CCO uses aren't playable in the vanilla game.  There are about 20 other misc wooden clutter items that CCO also allows you to "smelt" into charcoal.  I don't think Ars Metallica uses charcoal for anything, so I felt it only fair to leave these recipes off of the list as well.  CCO also has 13 additional recipes for dwarven scrap that allows different types of items to be smelted together into ingots; this greatly increases the chances that grabbing a random selection of dwarven scrap will still yield plenty of ingots.

 

A few other differences that I noted between CCO and Ars Metallica:

- Ars requires smithing perks in order to smelt both items and ores

- Ars adds recipes for the enchanted versions of Dark Brotherhood and Thieves Guild armors; CCO adds recipes to craft unenchanted versions of these armors

- Ars uses feathers in its arrow recipes

- Ars requires 4 plugin files to support vanilla + DLCs

- Ars changes the Hearthfire Carpenter's Workbenches to provide smithing experience

- Ars changes the Smelter & Tanning Rack to provide smithing experience (CCO provides an option for this, but since the change is made via script and not a direct edit, the animations for these objects don't work when the experience option is activated. Therefore, if you like using this feature Ars Metallic's implementation is slightly better).

 

Most of the other differences are in the changes to the recipes themselves (which I didn't take the time to compare) and in the additional features provided by CCO that aren't present in Ars Metallica.

 

NOTE: It appears that the only function of the Ars Metallica - Hearthfire.esp is to add the smithing experience to the Carpenter Workbenches, so if anyone wants this feature, you can use the Ars Metallica - Hearthfire plugin alongside CCO and it will work just as well as it does for Ars Metallica.

[Octopuss]

krypto, is it somehow technically possible to prevent equipped items from being smelted/deconstructed? There's no indication in the game what is what at all, and all you see for example in the smelter interface is just item names. I managed to smelt the armour I was wearing more than once simply because I just cannot keep track what is what and where.Also on similar note, is it possible to show how much would the stats delta when looking at recipes? For example, I am going through steel armour, and it would be great if I could see how much armour rating or whatever I'd get compared to the iron one I currently wear.