ACCEPTED Complete Crafting Overhaul Remade (by kryptopyr)

[Neovalen]

Something that I wanted to do in CCO that didn't get done for V1 was to fix the Lunar forge. I'm sure I'm not the only one who thought this was something special the first time they came across it in the game. I've always been rather disappointed that it's just another regular forge. In preparing to add this for CCO v2 (which won't be an imminent release), I'm looking for some thoughts, suggestions, or opinions (all of which are generally found in good supply around here).

 

1) What should the enchantment/power on the Lunar weapons be? The vanilla enchantment doesn't match the description. One or both need to be changed. Absorb health is the obvious one based on the game's description of the items, but there are some issues with using this depending on how the next question is answered.

 

2) Should the enchantment work like any other standard enchantment (i.e. it can be disenchanted from the weapon and learned)? Or should it work more like silver weapons, where the effect is an inherent part of the weapon, can't be disenchanted, but allows you to enchant additional effects onto the item?

 

3) Any suggestions for what additional conditions/ingredients should be required to craft these items. I have a pretty good idea how I want to handle this, but I'm still open to additional inspiration. I can tell say that it won't be a gimme; the player is going to need to do a bit of work to figure out how the forge operates.

Quick thoughts:

1) Drain health/stamina/magicka would work but you'd have to lower the magnitude to not be TOO overpowered, especially if all 3.

 

2) Part of the metal inherent, like silver.

 

3) A lunar weapon - perhaps werewolf fur/teeth, vampire dust, and/or black soul gem mixed in to the metal? Bonus for werewolves and vampires wielding the blade. Could be lots of interesting combinations here!

[kryptopyr]

Thanks for all the comments! With that in mind, let me elaborate on a few of the issues I've run into. My first thought was to give the blade an absorb health effect that was inherent to the blade, like silver, where you could still place custom enchantments on the weapon without losing the effect, but also couldn't disenchant the initial effect. This needs to be done using a perk, like the Silver weapons. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem possible to do this using an absorb health spell. I've tried to work around this in various ways, for example by applying both a damage spell to the target and a restore health spell to the wielder. This also doesn't work. I doesn't seem possible to give a targeted restore health effect to the wielder in this way.

So...

- I could give the weapons a damage health (and/or other attributes) effect, without restoring that same property in the wielder.

- I could give the wielder some constant effect (regenerate health, fortify health, etc) whenever they have the blade equipped.

- I can do both of these together, or give the damage health effect to anyone using the weapon, while the regenerate health part would only be given to vampires or werewolves.

- I could also just go with a straightforward enchantment, rather than a perk, which would allow me to give the weapons a true absorb health effect (and maybe throw an additional secondary effect in as well, so it's something unique). Going this route, I would make it so the effect couldn't be disenchanted, but you also won't be able to add any additional enchantments to the weapon.

- Or I can just go with another effect altogether... though from the responses, everyone seems to feel the way I do and think the absorb health is most appropriate.

 

All damages, bonuses, etc, would only take place at night, and the weapons will definitely have to be crafted at the Lunar forge at night. If possible, I'm going to try to make the Lunar forge work like a regular forge during the day and craft only Lunar weapons at night. I don't want to make the effect only work for werewolf and vampire characters, but I do like the idea that the effects would be stronger or have an extra bonus for them.

 

My current thought is that when the player first finds the forge, at night they'll be presented with a bunch of recipe options (something like 20 different recipes for an iron sword). These will all involve the standard sword recipe plus an extra ingredient or two. The player will have to experiment and try the various combinations until they discover the correct ingredients and thereby unlock the rest of the lunar weapons (all of which will require the special ingredient(s) in addition to the standard recipe).

[torminater]

Sounds awesom! Can't wait until it comes out!

If you let the enchantment that can't be unenchanted scale with the player, that would work out great for me.

[CJ2311]

Well, in case it hadn't been tested yet, the only conflicts between this and step extended are related to Bring Out Your Dead, where 4 NPCs won't have the BOYD script attached to them anymore. Easily solved if this were to be included in STEP.

 

...And Ars Metallica, but that one is obvious.

[Noobsayer]

- I could give the weapons a damage health (and/or other attributes) effect, without restoring that same property in the wielder.

- I could give the wielder some constant effect (regenerate health, fortify health, etc) whenever they have the blade equipped.

- I can do both of these together, or give the damage health effect to anyone using the weapon, while the regenerate health part would only be given to vampires or werewolves.

 

I really like this idea, and I don't even run vampire and werewolf characters really, lol. I have an idea for a were but never actually played one.

 

Sounds like your overhaul is going to make the Lunar Forge VERY nifty. :)

[Kelmych]

I really like having some purpose for the lunar forge; it always seemed like something fairly elaborate that was added in Skyrim but never finished. I also like the idea of health-related enhancements. From my viewpoint - I don't play as a werewolf or vampire - it would be useful to have 2 enhancement set choices for the special capabilities, one for normal characters and one for vampire/werewolf characters (as mentioned in one of the possibilities).

[statmonster]

- I could give the weapons a damage health (and/or other attributes) effect, without restoring that same property in the wielder.

- I could give the wielder some constant effect (regenerate health, fortify health, etc) whenever they have the blade equipped.

- I can do both of these together, or give the damage health effect to anyone using the weapon, while the regenerate health part would only be given to vampires or werewolves.

I really like this idea, and I don't even run vampire and werewolf characters really, lol. I have an idea for a were but never actually played one.

 

Sounds like your overhaul is going to make the Lunar Forge VERY nifty. :)

Agreed. Rather than making the enchantment more powerful for werewolves or vampires you could just make it "different". 

[torminater]

Hey kryptopyr,

I think there is a little issue with mining soul gems from the mining fields in Blackreach. With faster mining you'll only get one type of soul gems from each field, but in vanilla you might end up with 1 grand, 1 small, etc...

[kryptopyr]

So what you're saying is that when you mine a geode vein in vanilla, you get 2-3 random soul gems of any size, whereas with CCO you still receive the same number of soul gems, but they are always exactly the same type (3 common or 3 grand, etc)?

 

I've made a note to look at it. Thanks.

[torminater]

So what you're saying is that when you mine a geode vein in vanilla, you get 2-3 random soul gems of any size, whereas with CCO you still receive the same number of soul gems, but they are always exactly the same type (3 common or 3 grand, etc)?

 

I've made a note to look at it. Thanks.

Yep.

But I only get a "Common Soul Gem added." notification. Will test again to see whether I get 3 of them or not.

[kryptopyr]

It's possible you're only suppose to get one. I don't remember off-hand; I was just thinking that they used the same number as the regular ore veins. Generally, with the ore veins, you'll get 2 "Ore added" messages, even when you receive 3 ore, so it's also possible you're only getting one message but are receiving more than one soul gem.

[torminater]

Nope, it's a bug.

With faster mining I got one message "Greater Soulgem added." I only got 1 Soulgem from mining.

With vanilla mining I got two messages "Common Soul Gem added." "Greater Soulgem added." I got 2 Common and 1 Greater.

 

Always a pleasure to squash those pesky little bugs ;)

[Kragarth]

- I could also just go with a straightforward enchantment, rather than a perk, which would allow me to give the weapons a true absorb health effect (and maybe throw an additional secondary effect in as well, so it's something unique). Going this route, I would make it so the effect couldn't be disenchanted, but you also won't be able to add any additional enchantments to the weapon.

 

That sounds great to me. Personally, I don't think the lunar forge should be another cumulative bonus to weapons (giving us Lunar Forge + Temper + Enchant). Rather, it should be a tool for non-enchanter smiths to get an enchanted weapon.

[dreadflopp]

Sorry if this is a dumb question but I am fairly new to using tes5edit. I have replaced ars metallica in my step extended install with CCO and removed ars metallica from the step patch. When checking CCO in tes5edit it seems that alot of values are being overwritten by the bashed patch. Theese values seems too me to be item wight and value. I think they are overwritten because the CCO value/weight differs the most from all other values (vanilla, unoffical patches, step patch and others). Is there a way to make wrye bash prioritize by load order instead when choosing which value to use when creating the patch, instead of choosing the most common one or the one thats the least different. If that is whats happening. Or maybe it doesn't matter that much?

 

Edit: Also, item names and category are changed by the batch patch

[CJ2311]

Sorry if this is a dumb question but I am fairly new to using tes5edit. I have replaced ars metallica in my step extended install with CCO and removed ars metallica from the step patch. When checking CCO in tes5edit it seems that alot of values are being overwritten by the bashed patch. Theese values seems too me to be item wight and value. I think they are overwritten because the CCO value/weight differs the most from all other values (vanilla, unoffical patches, step patch and others). Is there a way to make wrye bash prioritize by load order instead when choosing which value to use when creating the patch, instead of choosing the most common one or the one thats the least different. If that is whats happening. Or maybe it doesn't matter that much?

 

Edit: Also, item names and category are changed by the batch patch

 

In Bash, under the masters list I mentioned earlier, there's a tags list; Use it to add a Stats and a Names tag to WAF and CCF.

Btw, Bash just uses the last values it finds, by default, not the most used.