ACCEPTED STEP Patches

[z929669]

@Tech:

I think that we can push this all out as STEP 2.2.8, since we will be adding a file to the Nexus (agree that we can include link to Guide in that file's ReadMe and do away with the PDF). We will also need to update the Nexus text on the wiki to explain what we are doing with the patch and how it should be used. Go ahead and update the "Release Procedures", and I will revise that and other resources as needed (probably on Sunday).

 

Regarding the Guide: I am not yet sure how best to incorporate the patch, but will dive into all of it on Sunday (I think). The Patch ReadMe on Git will provide the details that we can add to the Nexus ReadMe and the Guide (and the STEP:Patch Mod page).

 

Then we can push out the STEP:Core updates and ChangeLog and launch 2.2.8 either Sunday, next week, or the following weekend, depending on your availability.

 

@SRB, Tech, Nearox and anyone else:

I like the idea of moving everything we can into this patch, so if anyone is willing to contact the relevant authors and ask, that would be great. You can point them to this thread and/or to me on the nexus for further explanation if necessary. As I said previously, depending on mod permissions, we may not even need to ask some of these authors, so the Nexus file permissions and comments should be reviewed for the "mergeable" mods in question.

[Kelmych]

One of the most common problems for Hearthfire users is that mods can overwrite the 3 subrecords that have the name of each of the 3 Hearthfire houses. The patch I build for myself to load near the end of the load order includes these 3 subrecords so that Hearthfire works properly. I read the Readme.txt at GitHub and I don't see any mention of a patch for this. Does the compatibility patch include this, and if not should it? We frequently get questions about the Hearthfire house problem on STEP forums (including one today), and it would be great if we could mention that a STEP patch fixes the problem without requiring the user to remove mods (non-STEP mods, but nontheless useful mods). IMO it's really a Hearthfire problem, not a mod problem, but not something that a USKP patch can fix since it needs to be in a patch that loads near the end of the load order.

[EssArrBee]

Can you give me the IDs of those three records and I will double check?

[kryptopyr]

Something that might be worth considering for inclusion in the patch are the changes from .esps that only make changes to support textural diversity for a certain texture mod. For example Explosive Bolts Visualized, Elemental Staffs, Dawnguard Rune Weapon FX, and Pilgrims Delight all have .esp files with the sole purpose of changing the records to allow their different textures to apply to objects that had previously been referencing the same texture.

 

I've merged these files for my own use, but I would think it would be okay to include those edits in the STEP patch. Since the edits are referencing textures provided by those specific mods, it would still be a requirement to download those mods even if the player isn't using the .esp file included in the download.

[EssArrBee]

@kryp That's a great idea, I didn't even think of that. It is kinda like using USKP and not needing the SMIM plugin. I look at just how much I can jam into a single patch. Maybe we can get Extended around to the 100 plugin mark.

[Kelmych]

Can you give me the IDs of those three records and I will double check?

The cell values are in this post I entered a while ago. 

[EssArrBee]

Since Unique Region Names is no longer in STEP there is only a conflict with Birds and Flocks which is already patched. There are no Core mods that overwrite HF location names, and only a couple in Extended, but they are forwarded. People that add extra mods to their load order on top of STEP can't be helped because it is impossible to patch for every individual. We can always point people to using our patches and then adding to it for their own purposes, which is what I did with my personal setup.

[Kelmych]

I disagree. This is a problem that Hearthfires introduced and IMO should be fixed if Hearthfires is installed at all. Adding the patch records doesn't create problems for any mod that is added, and eliminates any future incompatibilities.

 

I also feel that the idea that Neo introduced in Skyrim Revisited of a small set of general patch records makes a lot of sense. These were added to take care of some common subrecord forwarding problems that would otherwise eventually lead to some frustrating and unnecessary incompatibilities. These 3 additions fit into that category.

 

I hadn't previously looked carefully at the plugins kryptopyr mentioned, but I agree it's an excellent idea to include these in a patch thus eliminating some plugins.

[EssArrBee]

Okay Kelmych, I get what you are saying. There looked to me like 7 places that should be forwarded in all. I don't see another mod making changes to that section, but some might leave off that location record.

 

I just uploaded the changed patches.

 

I'm still not going to start merging mods into the patch quite yet. I will add that into a 2.2.8 directory and start there.

[TechAngel85]

There are no patches still needed, I added any patch that was only patching two mods. The readme lists all of them in the installation instructions pretty clearly. It also covers all five patches, but do not upload the three extra patches on the nexus. It will only confuse people, so I will amend that part of the readme.

 

We can always stick the pdf in the archive with the patches or just make the readme more for using STEP to direct people to us.

 

Thanks Will, I think for a compilation process we should maybe do that as part of 2.2.8. It would be better than updating the site to add in a couple changes every time we get permission to add a new mod.

Something that might be worth considering for inclusion in the patch are the changes from .esps that only make changes to support textural diversity for a certain texture mod. For example Explosive Bolts Visualized, Elemental Staffs, Dawnguard Rune Weapon FX, and Pilgrims Delight all have .esp files with the sole purpose of changing the records to allow their different textures to apply to objects that had previously been referencing the same texture.

 

I've merged these files for my own use, but I would think it would be okay to include those edits in the STEP patch. Since the edits are referencing textures provided by those specific mods, it would still be a requirement to download those mods even if the player isn't using the .esp file included in the download.

Reading these, I take it that we're going forward with Patch compatibility being specifically to complete STEP installs only? The reason I ask is because when you start merging entire mods and ESP changes into the Patch that is what you're going to get. Users will have even less of a choice in flexibility of whether or not they wish to install certain mods because those mods will now be merged into the patch. Essentially, if they use the patch they're also using these merged mods without choice. I would rather see a third patch made that has these merged mods and ESPs instead of incorporating them into the two patches we have now. This will allow the users that do not wish to install all or some of the merged mods to be able to still benefit from the patches while at the same time retaining their freedom to pick and choose mods. This wouldn't be catering to individuals. It would just keep STEP a bit more flexible in regards to the patches.

 

z929669 Wrote

    @Tech:

    I think that we can push this all out as STEP 2.2.8, since we will be adding a file to the Nexus (agree that we can include link to Guide in that file's ReadMe and do away with the PDF). We will also need to update the Nexus text on the wiki to explain what we are doing with the patch and how it should be used. Go ahead and update the "Release Procedures", and I will revise that and other resources as needed (probably on Sunday).

 

    Regarding the Guide: I am not yet sure how best to incorporate the patch, but will dive into all of it on Sunday (I think). The Patch ReadMe on Git will provide the details that we can add to the Nexus ReadMe and the Guide (and the STEPTongueatch Mod page).

 

    Then we can push out the STEP:Core updates and ChangeLog and launch 2.2.8 either Sunday, next week, or the following weekend, depending on your availability.

 

    @SRB, Tech, Nearox and anyone else:

    I like the idea of moving everything we can into this patch, so if anyone is willing to contact the relevant authors and ask, that would be great. You can point them to this thread and/or to me on the nexus for further explanation if necessary. As I said previously, depending on mod permissions, we may not even need to ask some of these authors, so the Nexus file permissions and comments should be reviewed for the "mergeable" mods in question.

I'd rather get some of the mods in MT tested out before we release 2.2.8. This will take about a week (maybe two). We don't have to but I'd rather clean out that forum completely with 2.2.8. Some of those mod have been in there a good while. I'll get into contact with the MTs on getting the testing started. I haven't had much time to even scan for some new testing candidates. Most of the "popular" threads in MS aren't STEP candidates though. I will get the release procedures updated tonight or tomorrow and will download the readme for the patches so that I have that content.

 

As for the rest, read my comment above about my feelings in merging mods into the patches. Most of these authors will need to be asked. When I didn't my evaluation a while back I noticed most authors don't even bother setting up the permissions on Nexus.

[Kelmych]

Okay Kelmych, I get what you are saying. There looked to me like 7 places that should be forwarded in all. I don't see another mod making changes to that section, but some might leave off that location record.

 

I just uploaded the changed patches.

 

I'm still not going to start merging mods into the patch quite yet. I will add that into a 2.2.8 directory and start there.

If the patches you are creating are mod patches and don't necessarily load at the end, then the patch I suggest should probably be a separate small patch that loads at the end. It likely would include patches that affect Skyrim and DLC compatibility (like Neo's general patch records) vs. mod-specific patches except perhaps for forwarding some USKP patch subrecords that otherwise get added to many mods when creating mod-specific patches. Its masters would thus only include Skyrim, DLCs, and perhaps USKP plugins. The records would include copies of subrecords from the master files that are often overwritten unintentionally by mods that are changing different subrecords, especially on some of the records with many subrecords.

[Spock]

A small question about permission concerning the patch files:

If a pack has to cut one or more STEP mods that are included in the patch. Would it be ok if the pack author cut those mods from the patch (and maybe add new required entries) and re-release it for the pack if he credits you?

[EssArrBee]

You can pretty much chop those babies up any way you want. There really is no credit to give, just "The STEP Team". Any pack author is really just part of that team, so have at it. I would just say no need for STEP Patch because this patch inherits the changes.

[z929669]

@EssArrBee Hey so I read the pdf you linked and watched Gopher's videos on FNVEdit but I still don't understand why XLCW - Water Height was left out of Gilergreen Regrown. It seems like it shouldn't have been.

This is OT on this thread. Please post on the TESVEdit thread. Thanks.

---

RE incorporation of merge-able mods into the patch:

Totally understand that this should wait for 2.2.8, as it will require some Guide changes and maybe some feedback from the mod authors of affected mods (but I think that most do not explicitly prohibit reuse for our purposes). It is probably best to send each affected mod author a brief note on the Nexus that we are consuming their entire plugin into our patch, just FYI ... and welcome them to join us on this forum to express any ideas, suggestions or objections if they have them. Seriously, this is all that is really needed for most if not all of them. If you provide me a list of affected mods, I can do this myself (perhaps that is best anyway).

 

Also, if you (SRB) or anyone else wants to make one big patch for STEP:Core in its entirety, I think that is most appropriate as the baseline, default patch (Main File on Nexus), because it makes absolutely no sense for all STEP:Core mods not to be installed by everyone. As I have said many times previously, if there is some reason that any STEP:Core mod would not be installed by someone, then speak out and let's revisit its place in STEP:Core. I would not bother with STEP:Extended at this point, but it is entirely up to you guys. That has not had any of the staff's attention for some time ... need to clean up all prerequisites first.

 

Any other patch variants are at the creator's discretion, but we will want to keep it all very simple on the Nexus and in the Guide, so any variants should have a very clear and obvious purpose (i.e., if you want to provide patches for users that don't have all the DLC for example).

[TechAngel85]

Any comment on my post on the previous page about mod merging?