[NSFW] STEP Female Body Replacer

[TechAngel85]

I'm afraid at this point we only have a couple options:

• Use Vanilla
• Use current STEP (which frankly looks worse than vanilla, IMO)
• Use one of the replacers and include the armors for that replacer (all replacers have a range of armors available)
• Compile our own compilation of mods that "fix" issues with vanilla but still works with vanilla
• Create our own female replacer that works perfect with vanilla (any mesh and texture artists around here?)

[thommaal]

Point (3), definitely. Compared to (4) and (5), it's far more flexible. Any user of CBBE, UNP/UNPB can always choose to add Bodyslide to his configuration to add even more armour and clothing if the available packs don't satisfy.

 

From my pov, it's more important to give the STEP user as wide a variety of mods as possible to continue in his modding experience than force a specific but limited choice onto him.

[TechAngel85]

Point (3), definitely. Compared to (4) and (5), it's far more flexible. Any user of CBBE, UNP/UNPB can always choose to add Bodyslide to his configuration to add even more armour and clothing if the available packs don't satisfy.

 

From my pov, it's more important to give the STEP user as wide a variety of mods as possible to continue in his modding experience than force a specific but limited choice onto him.

This was the point in finding a vanilla-friendly replacer. That way armors were a non-issue and everything would would with the replacer. It would work with the game out of the box without jumping through any hoops.

 

Having a non-vanilla replacer is doing more of what you're saying about forcing a specific choice. If we decide on CBBE or UNP, then only those compatibly armors can been used and only texture replacers (skin, etc) that are compatible with that choice can be used as well as only armors for that replace can be used.  At this point, there is not a female replacer that fits the STEP:Core Mandate. The replacer would have to go into Extended as it's changing a lot from the vanilla game. Mesh (size and shape), skin texture, compatible non-vanilla armors and so on and so on.

[kryptopyr]

Well, that's disappointing.  I was really hoping that CNHF would work with the vanilla armors.  I can't see adding any mod that requires individual armor replacements to STEP Core, and personally I would really dislike seeing it added to even STEP Extended.  If STEP decides to go with body meshes that require installing compatible armors, then I hope that they'll be added to a separate, specialized body-mod pack.  This would maintain greater compatibility with other user-made packs and allow for more flexibility in personal preference when installing STEP.

 

What mesh fixes are currently in STEP?  The only real issue I see with the vanilla mesh is the horrible feet.  This is the single improvement that I see in the STEP version versus the vanilla shots.  Can we use the current STEP mesh and maybe find some better textures?  Prometheus also retains the ugly vanilla feet, so I can't really see any way this can be argued as a fix for the vanilla mesh, even if it had no other issues.

[thommaal]

True, TechAngel85, every single body replacer opens up its own universe of mods while closing incompatible ones out. However, every popular replacer has plenty of textures, clothing and armour mods at its disposal. Compatibility with other mods is improved by XP32 Maximum Skeleton -XPMS or specific patches that are far more likely to be present for a popular mod than a STEP-specific one.Add Bodyslide (not into STEP, of course) and there is no end to content for the dedicated gamer.I've tried all the popular replacers -- and I really don't care which one is chosen; they are all flexible enough to allow further adaptation at will.No replacer is ideal, I agree - but any popular one is better than the current state of affairs.

Edited April 13, 2014 by thommaal

[TechAngel85]

Currently, the only fixes for meshes/textures in STEP is XCE which is what is providing the feet fix. The textures for XCE aren't good though because although they smooth out the skin some, they also introduce some greyness which is looking terrible. This is what XCE provideds:

• - Adds more detail to skin of faces and bodies
• - Gets rid of angular shapes caused by compressed normal maps
• - Adds a lot more detail to the eyes
• - Makes the fingernails more visible
• - Removes jagged edges from the lips
• - Adds more detailed, healed scars
• - Makes the warpaint look more weathered
• - Makes the face dirt more detailed
• - Adds high quality female feet
• - Gets rid of neck seams

And here are the mods that XCE integrates:

• Detailed Faces
• Detailed Bodies
• Detailed Lips
• No More Blocky Faces
• High Quality Eyes
• High Resolution Scars
• Weathered Warpaint and Improved Dirt
• High Res Face Maps for Men by Geonox (Edited to fit body skin color)
• FemFeet by Phygit (Edited to fit body skin color)
• Lashmaker Eyelash Alpha Resource by Mr Dave (Edited)

The problem with finding a skin texture is that I haven't found one that is designed to work with vanilla that still looks good and is vanilla-frienldly. The good ones are made for either CBBE or UNP, but none of the authors bother to make a vanilla version.

[Smile44]

This is why I suggested some days ago that STEP might be better off not having a suggested female body replacer because whichever way you go there will be potential problems, such as vanilla compatibility. I don't know what anyone thought of the idea I suggested as an alternative because it looked as though my post was misinterpreted and the main point of it missed.

 

The idea was that instead of recommending a specific mod or group of mods STEP could recommend that a mesh and texture re-placer is used and then link to a sub-guide which has a number of options with pictures so that users could make their own mind up about what they want to use. e.g. Neo's recommendations from SR would include a correct install of XP32, Mature Skin, UNPB Redux, UNP Dawnguard armors, UNP Dragonborn armors, UNP Femaile armors etc.. Other's could post similar mod combinations that have been tested and shown to be working well together. SFW and sensible proportion options could be highlighted but essentially this is one area that will have a variety of different tastes and preferences there just isn't a mod that does for female characters what Better Males does for male characters.

 

[CJ2311]

This is why I suggested some days ago that STEP might be better off not having a suggested female body replacer because whichever way you go there will be potential problems, such as vanilla compatibility. I don't know what anyone thought of the idea I suggested as an alternative because it looked as though my post was misinterpreted and the main point of it missed.

That's also what I've been suggesting. Adding a body replacer like UNP or CBBE to STEP Core would just cause endless problems (I'm repeating myself here, but both of these mods do not have full support for the vanilla armors/clothes)

What mesh fixes are currently in STEP?  The only real issue I see with the vanilla mesh is the horrible feet.  This is the single improvement that I see in the STEP version versus the vanilla shots.  Can we use the current STEP mesh and maybe find some better textures?  Prometheus also retains the ugly vanilla feet, so I can't really see any way this can be argued as a fix for the vanilla mesh, even if it had no other issues.

If that's the only issue, why not simply include FemFeet only in STEP? (Although that would require adding a texture replacer too, seeing as how the vanilla textures apparently do not work with FemFeet)

[TechAngel85]

Wasn't ignored or misinterpreted. We just back up things around here with real data. Until that testing is done and the data presented, we never take things at face value or user's words. No offense to anyone here. That's just how STEP operates. Now that we have the data the backs up the claims that no replacer is going to work with vanilla for females, we can move on to other options (posted above). It's likely that we'll simply not use a female replacer in Core because I don't think either myself or Z wants to take the route in having to add in several other mods to maintain compatibility. The Core Mandate also doesn't support that route so the other staff shouldn't really see that as an option for Core either.

 

With that said, I also don't like what XCE is doing with the skin texture colors either. Because of this, I think a compilation or finding an alternative skin texture that works with XCE might be the best route for Core. I have yet to find one though for the reasons previously stated.

 

On the other side of that coin, STEP:Extended is going to be the STEP Official Pack. Remember, when STEP 2.3.0 launches, the Extended mods will be moved into a pack and out of the main Guide. Thus, only Core has to remain as compatible as possible with packs. Since Extended is going to be a pack in and of itself, it doesn't necessarily have to remain compatible with other packs. Therefore, adding in one of the replacers to Extended is still a viable option.

[Maticspaz]

I came accross this topic searching for what i could have possibly done wrong in my STEP install after i noticed so many npc's looked grey. Now after reading through this..NOOOOooooo!  this is what they are supposed to look like with STEP?  Ouch..

I guess i need to decide now what replacer to use..seems CBBE/UNP are the 2 biggies with the most compatible armors..but man, i was really hoping to not have to go down this road. And hard to believe noone ever made a texture that would be compatible with this setup.

 

The grey npc's though is just unacceptable. We do so much to get this game looking decent, and now i dont even wanna go back in untill i get this sorted.

[CJ2311]

I came accross this topic searching for what i could have possibly done wrong in my STEP install after i noticed so many npc's looked grey. Now after reading through this..NOOOOooooo!  this is what they are supposed to look like with STEP?  Ouch..I guess i need to decide now what replacer to use..seems CBBE/UNP are the 2 biggies with the most compatible armors..but man, i was really hoping to not have to go down this road. And hard to believe noone ever made a texture that would be compatible with this setup. The grey npc's though is just unacceptable. We do so much to get this game looking decent, and now i dont even wanna go back in untill i get this sorted.

You don't really have to install a body MESH replacer like UNP or CBBE to get rif of the gray textures, you only need to add other textures on top on your install.

[Maticspaz]

You don't really have to install a body MESH replacer like UNP or CBBE to get rif of the gray textures, you only need to add other textures on top on your install.

IS there a texture i can simply install over STEP that will work properly and cover the grey? After reading through this i was under the impression there wasnt. And if there is, why isnt it included in STEP already?

This is exactly what i was hoping to find if it exists..i really dont wanna have to give all female npc's CBBE/UNP bodies if i dont have to. But the grey just looks so awful..

[z929669]

CNHF is the only possible mesh replacer for STEP, and it looks like I am going to have to test with STEP's existing Core clothing and armor replacers.

 

We are not going to adopt any body-specific clothing/armors. We want aMB et al. to work on all STEP bodies, so vanilla-body compat is key (unless every clothing and armor mod under STEP offers a CNHF version where needed ... or we modify them ourselves).

 

I will figure something out and propose a solution to all of this in the next week or two (or three or four).

 

If anyone else wants to do some testing, this is what I have in mind (using XP32 skeleton; need to look at different races as well):

• Examine pure vanilla female meshes/textures under STEP:Core (i.e., get rid of all female body mods):
  • nude
  • clothing (I'll pick a few different outfits to test)
  • armor (I'll test as many armors as possible)
• Examine current female STEP:Core body as previous (i.e., with all female body mods currently in STEP:Core)
• Examine CNHF 2.5 female body under STEP:Core under both scenarios above and under Mature Skin and possible other texture options.

I'll need to create my first female character (no, I have never created a female char in all my years of playing TES games) under various races for testing.

 

This will take me a very long time without help, so if you want to help, then jump in. Be warned though that I am methodical, and I won't include others' contributions unless they follow same methodology (i.e., I will just do it over myself). I will start with a Nord female, so maybe others could pick a different humanoid race. There is always the chance that I will see a different path as I go and change all of the rules though, so I could just be full of crap in the end :P

[Smile44]

Interestingly I have just been looking at a mod which is recommended by prod80 on his Serenity enb page. This is a replacer called "Lady Body by Krista", and is hosted either in Russian on the authors site and translated in a site called blackelf. It is very good quality though the textures are a little too glamorous. What makes this interesting though is that it includes all the clothing and armours meshes from the game all in one download.

 

I am going to try it with Mature Skins to see if it improves the look for me - still one mod everything you need.

 

 

Edit: works with Mature Skin. LINK https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B3Wxfg5AcXx-RDVKMzRYY2djeDQ/preview?pli=1 (sorry am on a pad)

Edited April 13, 2014 by Smile44

[TechAngel85]

CNHF is the only possible mesh replacer for STEP, and it looks like I am going to have to test with STEP's existing Core clothing and armor replacers.

 

We are not going to adopt any body-specific clothing/armors. We want aMB et al. to work on all STEP bodies, so vanilla-body compat is key (unless every clothing and armor mod under STEP offers a CNHF version where needed ... or we modify them ourselves).

 

I will figure something out and propose a solution to all of this in the next week or two (or three or four).

 

If anyone else wants to do some testing, this is what I have in mind (using XP32 skeleton; need to look at different races as well):

• Examine pure vanilla female meshes/textures under STEP:Core (i.e., get rid of all female body mods):
  • nude
  • clothing (I'll pick a few different outfits to test)
  • armor (I'll test as many armors as possible)
• Examine current female STEP:Core body as previous (i.e., with all female body mods currently in STEP:Core)
• Examine CNHF 2.5 female body under STEP:Core under both scenarios above and under Mature Skin and possible other texture options.

I'll need to create my first female character (no, I have never created a female char in all my years of playing TES games) under various races for testing.

 

This will take me a very long time without help, so if you want to help, then jump in. Be warned though that I am methodical, and I won't include others' contributions unless they follow same methodology (i.e., I will just do it over myself). I will start with a Nord female, so maybe others could pick a different humanoid race. There is always the chance that I will see a different path as I go and change all of the rules though, so I could just be full of crap in the end :P

 

I've basically done this over the last week with a female nord. The result were the seems. Not sure how you're planning on getting rid of those since the vanilla armors use the vanilla body; thus, undoing the replacer mod. In other words, you're never going to get the CNHF body with a vanilla armor. You might find a few that work okay, but the first basic armor you get in the game isn't even working without seams. Not sure what you plan to accomplish in your testing knowing these facts.

 

PS: Mature Skin is made for CBBE and UNP. CNHF is an entirely different mod than those two. The author is trying to include some UNP compatibility but it's not made outright to be compatible.

 

A quick texture analysis shows that Mature Skin for UNP leaves a neck seam. Mature Skin for CBBE leaves wrist seams. However, SG Female Textures Renewal (UNP version) is working perfectly.

 

Here is my install order for CNHF 2.5:

[*]CNHF 2.5

[*]D-cup

[*]No Texture

[*]SFW D-cup Patch

[*]SG Female Texture Renewal (UNP)