DROPPED Immersive Citizens - AI Overhaul (by Shurah)

[Nazenn]

That's fine, I understand English is a barrier, but we stated multiple times that we were NOT asking him to do any patching, only more information about what 'bugs' there were so we could do it ourselves. I really don't think we could have been clearer then to say "we aren't asking you to make patches". All I wanted was information on what all these bugs were that he found, and apparently keeps finding with mods set up to be compatible with ICAIO, but that information is never delivered.

The only issue I know of right now is that JKs Lite Whiterun has misplaced archery targets because I forgot to save which means they shoot at walls.

[elwaps]

Also, in Solitude it appears that the grinder stone was moved, I once saw the blacksmith sit & grind in mid-air.

[TechAngel85]

I said what I said because Shurah needed help with his description so the STEP team helped him. I still have admin rights and have seen a few words here and there that could be fixed, but have yet to do so.

 

I know it's frustrating, but lets keep the tone positive and see if Shurah will be willing to work with you guys here. The atmosphere on the STEP forums is more relaxed and you have little to no "haters" beating you down. The guy seemed very cooperative and easy to work with when we helped him. I think he might be willing help out in the right setting. Nexus is almost never that setting. That's why I've turned off my comments on my mod over there and have directed users to my topic here on the STEP forums. Much as Sheson has done for DynDOLOD.

[elwaps]

My post wasn't meant to be negative, I just added my observations to Nazenn's last line. I also don't citicize Shurah for not providing patches, every mod author providing patches for every existing mod only happens in an utopian dream world. Instead I'm happy to have IC and can live with those minor bugs very well, in the end it is my choice combining JK Lite, ETaC and IC and hope for the best and for theoretically conflicting mods they work surprisingly well. 

[darkside]

They are not asking for shurah to make a patch. They just need to know what was not compatible or conflicted. MJB and Nazeen are willing to make their mods compatible.

Edited December 9, 2015 by darkside

[Shadriss]

... and for theoretically conflicting mods they work surprisingly well. 

This has been my observation as well. I've yet to see any AI, routing, or any other behavior that isn't as I normally expect... with two possible exceptions that, as far as I can tell, are just as likely to be Random Acts of Skyrim as anything else. If there are true incompatibilities, here's to hoping everything gets mashed out... but as for me and my rig, we shall rule the tundra.

[n0mad23]

I apologize if I inadvertently stirred the wasps' nest here.  It wasn't my intent, but rather attempting to understand what the issue is behind these mods not cooperating (yet).

 

Mostly I'm still kicking myself for getting so involved in a play-through when there was a ETaC patch waiting for me to test drive!

 

When I work, I'm a college English professor so I'll officially volunteer here and now to make myself available for any assistance Mod authors posting here with technical writing, specifically if it involves language barrier/translation issues.  I'm still fairly good at reading and writing in French (though it's fossilized enough I struggle to speak it) and a smattering of intact Bahasa Indonesian (which means Malay, too).

 

I'd sure like to help in anyway I can.

 

Cheers.

[Nazenn]

I'm more then happy to work with him and give some time to get things sorted, its a great mod and all I want is to be able to improve its usability as much as possible, even if I don't get to use it that much myself because it uses a lot of additional memory and also because I cant go back to towns being two houses and ten people in an inn XD.

I love the atmosphere here and in no way wish to disrupt that, its a fantastic break from some of the more edgy places for modding, even though I don't get to spend much time here (too many forums), and you guys have been a great help in improving my own mods as well.

[jbvertexx]

Very helpful discussion thread here.  My own viewpoint is that I tend to respect mod authors' decisions on how they support their mods.  There are too many critical people out there in the community.  Shurah has clearly spent a great deal of time on ICAIO, and we never know what other circumstances there are in an author's life....  At least he is updating the compatibility article in an effort to keep that up to date.  Sure, it would be nice if he shared additional information, but I would tend to lean on the side of respecting his decisions given the contributions he has already made.  I have played a short play-thru with ICAIO, and the mod really enhances the overall skyrim experience in ways that no other mod has.  

 

Off my soapbox...  What I am really writing about is to ask about the memory use of ICAIO.  I'm not sure I understand any potential issue here.  Does ICAIO consume system memory or GPU memory?  Under what conditions has anyone run into a problem with that?

 

Thanks!

[Nazenn]

It consumes the engines memory to be able to assign the alias' to the NPCs that hold the new AI packages. Where the problem comes in is that they are applying to every NPC in the world, and the packages use up a lot of memory comparatively to other features, and if you are running other NPC mods that can stack quite quickly. On top of that, if an NPC dies, even though its AI stops being processed, the memory used by the alias' never gets freed which means you don't get that back for use with things that are still affecting your game. Considering Skyrim's engine has a 3.1 GB memory cap, if using it with a lot of other mods you can find your memory running out a lot quicker then you'd expect, which is greatly amplified if using mods that add NPCs around.

If you run a lighter game, or aren't having any memory issues otherwise, or don't add a lot of NPCs, it shouldn't be too much of an issue though.

Edited December 18, 2015 by Nazenn

[shurah]

I apologize if I inadvertently stirred the wasps' nest here.  It wasn't my intent, but rather attempting to understand what the issue is behind these mods not cooperating (yet).

 

Mostly I'm still kicking myself for getting so involved in a play-through when there was a ETaC patch waiting for me to test drive!

 

When I work, I'm a college English professor so I'll officially volunteer here and now to make myself available for any assistance Mod authors posting here with technical writing, specifically if it involves language barrier/translation issues.  I'm still fairly good at reading and writing in French (though it's fossilized enough I struggle to speak it) and a smattering of intact Bahasa Indonesian (which means Malay, too).

 

I'd sure like to help in anyway I can.

 

Cheers.

Thank you for proposing your help. The description as well as my article have been updated, I hope that it solves misunderstandings.

 

 

 

Off my soapbox...  What I am really writing about is to ask about the memory use of ICAIO.  I'm not sure I understand any potential issue here.  Does ICAIO consume system memory or GPU memory?  Under what conditions has anyone run into a problem with that?

 

Thanks!

Quick answer: no performance impact

The answer is really easy to get by yourself, it takes only 5 minutes.

I tested on a medium and on a low rig by using Skyrim Performance Monitor, EVGA precision X and the performance monitor tool from Windows 7. I couldn't spot a single impact on performance in game, even by spamming my game with extra NPCs. As mentioned in the description, the only performance impact you may spot is when you load my plugin for the first time. This minor issue will be fixed soon through an activation system similar to frostfall.

 

In short, no one has been able to prove that there is an impact on performance once the plugin has been loaded in your save (I didn't even get a single report about performance impact). If you don't believe me, as I said, it's easy to test by yourself.

Edited December 18, 2015 by shurah

[Nazenn]

Oh, I apologize if I implied there was a direct performance hit to FPS or anything as there certainly isn't, its purely just an increase in background memory usage.

[jbvertexx]

 Considering Skyrim's engine has a 3.1 GB memory cap, if using it with a lot of other mods you can find your memory running out a lot quicker then you'd expect, which is greatly amplified if using mods that add NPCs around.

 

Quick answer: no performance impact

The answer is really easy to get by yourself, it takes only 5 minutes.

I tested on a medium and on a low rig by using Skyrim Performance Monitor, EVGA precision X and the performance monitor tool from Windows 7. I couldn't spot a single impact on performance in game, even by spamming my game with extra NPCs. As mentioned in the description, the only performance impact you may spot is when you load my plugin for the first time. This minor issue will be fixed soon through an activation system similar to frostfall.

Thanks for both responses.  So I would want to look at the Memory usage (not VRAM) in Skyrim performance monitor - max is 3.1GB.  What happens when you hit 3.1GB?  Does the game CTD or just have degradation?

 

Also, would this have an impact on settings in the memory patch?  (DefaultHeapInitialAllocMB=768, ScrapHeapSizeMB=256)

Edited December 18, 2015 by jbvertexx

[TechAngel85]

As long as you're using ENBoost, you won't have to worry about the 3.1GB memory cap.

[jbvertexx]

Awesome - thanks!