New STEP Vsync Settings (all STEP users affected!)

TechAngel85 · July 30, 2015

If you change the ugrids and still use DynDOLOD, you'll need to edit the settings before running DynDOLOD because it assumes a ugrids of 5 and is thus specifically set up for it.

Also, there have been cases of things breaking even with ugrids set at 7. The entire game is designed around the default of 5 so change at your own risk.

oqhansoloqo · July 30, 2015

STEP no longer recommends uGrids go any higher than 5 - at all. There is less need due to DynDOLOD than previously for distance landscape quality purposes. I believe Tech and some others are currently reviewing the need for the Stable uGrids mod, because there may be something desirable in the mod even for those that keep their uGrids at the highly recommended 5. Tech - care to elaborate for me, what that is? :)

TechAngel85 · July 30, 2015

That part I'm not sure about. It was DY saying that, not me. [emoji106]

DoubleYou · July 30, 2015

uGridsToLoad

uGridsToLoad sets how much of the world is rendered around the player. The value may only be an odd number 5 or higher. Values below 5 will be rounded up to 5. Even numbers shall be rounded up to the higher odd number (e.g., a value of 6 is becomes 7). Negative values cause CTD. It is recommended to be left at its default value. Higher values will likely bug out the game over time. Default is 5.
uGridsToLoad=(5,7,9,...)

The above is what we have in the INI Guide for the uGridsToLoad setting, and I think everybody can agree on it.

As to the Stable uGridsToLoad mod, if I remember correctly, I believe the reason why the mod was needed was to prevent a bug where switching different uGridsToLoad settings in a current save safely. Also, it made higher uGridsToLoad settings stable, which was useful for screen archers and others who decided they wanted to see more detail. Also, I think the way that it made these things stable was because it fixed a vanilla bug related to the Grids, which has not been fully explained anywhere as far as I know. However, I do recall it being some kind of "caching" issue with cells or something maybe? I'm not sure. But, until we're sure, I think it unwise to remove a mod that...

A. Does not cause issues when uGridsToLoad is left at its default value

B. Solves problems when uGridsToLoad is raised

C. Allows saved games to load that won't load without in cases where the uGridsToLoad value was previously altered

D. Fixes a vanilla bug that has not been fully explained which may afflict users using the default uGridsToLoad value

E. Does not take a plugin slot and has no known conflicts

For these reasons, I advocate keeping it.

uGridsToLoad works like this:

O O O O O

The red dot is you. When you set uGridsToLoad to 5 (the default value), all the O's represent the Grids (25) loaded. Setting this to 7 results in:

O O O O O O O

Now you have loaded 49 Grids, about twice as much as default. That's why it causes a performance difference. That's why it causes problems. Twice the amount of scripts, people, whatever, is put into action, and the game was built around 5. Strong systems may be able to keep up with all of that, but Papyrus is pretty slow last I checked (papyrus is a rather ancient form of writing :;): ) so even strong systems could gain undue stress and problems from even this small increase.

n0mad23 · July 30, 2015

I have to agree with Kesta here. I've been using Stable uGridsToLoad set at 7 for months now and haven't had even a hiccup with it. Granted, my laptop does qualify as a modern computer (i7 quad core, Nvidia GTX 970M - 6 gigs VRAM, 8 gigs system RAM) but I'll tell you it sure keeps my Grass on Steroids from popping up at obscenely close ranges now. Even in the peskiest ugrids areas (the road between Riverwood and Helgen) I never, ever crash and the very worst I might experience a couple moments of stuttering there. However, I'm pretty sure that as with most things Skyrim related, this is going to really depend on your machine and the mods you are running.

For me, what really helped stability more than any other single thing was ENBoost. I cannot recommend this to the modding community enough!

Back on topic here -

Is there any reason not to force Vsych through Nvidia control panel? Additionally, if you use the enblocal.ini to force vsych, will "doubling up" with Nvidia control panel cause any problems?

Edit -

Several posts got up before mine actually got done, so I'm now wondering if I haven't been fooling myself about having ugrids set to 7. I guess time will tell - I'll be sure to post if I start having troubles with it.

TechAngel85 · July 31, 2015

@n0mad

This is a trial and error thing to try. You really don't need two vsyncs enables. Some users experience smoother results with ENB's version and that is what STEP recommends. In my system, I think both worked equally well, but I never ran two at once either.

oqhansoloqo · July 31, 2015

The above is what we have in the INI Guide for the uGridsToLoad setting, and I think everybody can agree on it.

As to the Stable uGridsToLoad mod, if I remember correctly, I believe the reason why the mod was needed was to prevent a bug where switching different uGridsToLoad settings in a current save safely. Also, it made higher uGridsToLoad settings stable, which was useful for screen archers and others who decided they wanted to see more detail. Also, I think the way that it made these things stable was because it fixed a vanilla bug related to the Grids, which has not been fully explained anywhere as far as I know. However, I do recall it being some kind of "caching" issue with cells or something maybe? I'm not sure. But, until we're sure, I think it unwise to remove a mod that...

A. Does not cause issues when uGridsToLoad is left at its default value
B. Solves problems when uGridsToLoad is raised
C. Allows saved games to load that won't load without in cases where the uGridsToLoad value was previously altered
D. Fixes a vanilla bug that has not been fully explained which may afflict users using the default uGridsToLoad value
E. Does not take a plugin slot and has no known conflicts

For these reasons, I advocate keeping it.

uGridsToLoad works like this:

O O O O O
O O O O O
O O O O O
O O O O O
O O O O O

The red dot is you. When you set uGridsToLoad to 5 (the default value), all the O's represent the Grids (25) loaded. Setting this to 7 results in:

O O O O O O O
O O O O O O O
O O O O O O O
O O O O O O O
O O O O O O O
O O O O O O O
O O O O O O O

Now you have loaded 49 Grids, about twice as much as default. That's why it causes a performance difference. That's why it causes problems. Twice the amount of scripts, people, whatever, is put into action, and the game was built around 5. Strong systems may be able to keep up with all of that, but Papyrus is pretty slow last I checked (papyrus is a rather ancient form of writing ) so even strong systems could gain undue stress and problems from even this small increase.

Thank you DY for your well-thought response.

n0mad23 · July 31, 2015

@TechAngel85 -

Thanks. I've got mine enabled with enblocal.ini and set to "Use the 3d Application Setting" in control panel. I think I'll try disabling it in enblocal and turning it on with control panel to see if I can notice any differences. I like that there's more than one option in this case.

Cheers.

rothbardian · July 31, 2015

The question I have is how to cap fps at 59.9 but *also* disable Vsync. If you have a high end computer and at 144hz G-sync monitor, Vsync really shouldn't be used since G-sync does away with tearing without compromising frame rate. How do I make sure Vsync is off?

Kesta · July 31, 2015

I have to agree with Kesta here. I've been using Stable uGridsToLoad set at 7 for months now and haven't had even a hiccup with it.

While I do like to know people agree with me, "I've been doing it without issues" is not enough to consider a tweak / mod /whatever as stable. It's like saying : I've made entire playthroughs without the USKP nor the SKSE memory patch without problem and didn't notice any problems ^^

@Staff : maybe moving part of this discussion to the stable uGridToLoad thread ? We've been offtopic for a while now... (ye, my fault :/)

n0mad23 · July 31, 2015

@Kesta -

Right you are. Sometimes my enthusiasm gets the best of me. I did realize after posting those lines that really, probability speaking, being CTD free for months really means that the next inevitable CTD is probably closer now than not. Really for me it's more of a question of "when" than "if."

paradoxbound · August 1, 2015

The question I have is how to cap fps at 59.9 but *also* disable Vsync. If you have a high end computer and at 144hz G-sync monitor, Vsync really shouldn't be used since G-sync does away with tearing without compromising frame rate. How do I make sure Vsync is off?

Could someone with better knowledge confirm my setting LIMITER in enblocal.ini to 59.9 is a valid fix?

Greg · August 1, 2015

This is the setting I use per the STEP guide, but I use an AMD video card without G-sync.

[LIMITER]
WaitBusyRenderer=false
EnableFPSLimit=true
FPSLimit=59.9

EDIT: If you have an Nvidia card, I think you can accomplish the same thing via Nvidia Inspector.

TechAngel85 · August 1, 2015

STEP does not recommend a setting with the Limiter. :;):

rothbardian · August 1, 2015

How do you make sure that Vsync is off?

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