ACCEPTED Audio Overhaul for Skyrim (by David Jegutidse)

[egocarib]

If you'll be re-releasing an update, I would suggest adding a version number to the description field of the main AOS.esp files. That will make it much easier for LOOT to notify users if they are using an old version that they should upgrade.

 

Since Mod Authors forum is restricted I'll just paste this here. This was posted before BOSSv3 become LOOT, so you can ignore that:

 

 

I thought this crowd would be interested to know that the upcoming BOSS version 3 will now support versioning for plugins.What this means for mod authors:I would strongly recommend that it become a new "best practice" to include version numbers with the plugins you release.It is now much easier to condition any necessary messages or warnings in the BOSS masterlist if you include version numbers with your files. For instance, if you create MyMod version 1.0, which is incompatible with Hearthfires, but then you later release an upgrade to version 1.1, which is now compatible with Hearthfires, this info can very easily be added to the masterlist and conditioned upon a simple version check of your mod. Another common use of versioning would be to much more easily inform users if they are using an outdated version of the mod and need to upgrade. These sorts of warnings have not always been easy to add in the past because in order to do it, the CRC of every single version of the .esp ever released would have to be added to the masterlist and checked by BOSS, and accorded the relevant message. Moreover, the BOSS team should have much more time to respond to requests to add version (or other) info to your plugins after v3 is released, since there will no longer be the need to manually update the masterlist with every single mod that ever gets released -- the focus can instead be on adding important  metadata to the specific plugins that need it.How to version your plugins:All you need to do is add, on a separate line by itself anywhere in your plugin's description box:"Version: X"Boss will read all version numbers included this way. (The description box is what shows up when you open the CK, choose "Data" and highlight a plugin name)Examples:Version: 1.0Version: 2.0.13Version: 4aetc.BOSS v3 Beta 8 (the current test release) displays version numbers by default beneath plugin names in its report (can be turned off by the user) but this is another incentive to include them, I think - they'll be visible to your users and may keep them more alert to potential updates. Furthermore, including version numbers will also allow other mods to include conditional BOSS messages based on the version of -your- mod a user has installed, if that should be relevant. So there are a lot of different angles to see this from, and, all-in-all, I think there are quite a few important reasons to promote plugin versioning among mod authors. :)

 

 

[keithinhanoi]

If you'll be re-releasing an update, I would suggest adding a version number to the description field of the main AOS.esp files. That will make it much easier for LOOT to notify users if they are using an old version that they should upgrade.

 

Thanks for that information egocarib - I don't think I would have found this on my own, as it seems you've quoted an old forum post as the source? I imagine documentation for mod authors including this will be collected together in one place soon enough.

 

However, David (LoRd KoRn) is the author, so I can pass this on to him.

 

I'm curious, though - since this talks about making sure one line in the description has this version number, can this only be accomplished in the CK, and not using TES5Edit? (I've never tried typing in a multiple line description in TES5Edit.)

 

Also, since AOS now has 4 variants of the main plugin, all with the same name (AOS.esp), it seems a good idea to indicate that in the description with this version text, so something like "Version: 2.1", "Version: 2.1 DG", "Version: 2.1 DB", and "Version: 2.1 DG+DB". It seems that would be helpful as confirmation to a user about which variant they have installed, in addition to the version number.

 

What do you think?

[egocarib]

You can edit it in TES5Edit, you need to shift + double click the description field to open the multi-line editor.

 

You could indicate the variant versions like you've suggested there if you want, as well. As long as there's some kind of indication. I only pointed it out because I was trying to update the metadata for the new AOS yesterday but there was only so much I could do without the version numbers.

[Gekko64]

I wanted to point out that michaelrw used to offer a Skyre Patch Patch, intended to be used by those who used qotsafan's patches. I can confirm it still works nicely with xathra's patches, therefore it should also be included in the fomod imo :)

[keithinhanoi]

You can edit it in TES5Edit, you need to shift + double click the description field to open the multi-line editor. You could indicate the variant versions like you've suggested there if you want, as well. As long as there's some kind of indication. I only pointed it out because I was trying to update the metadata for the new AOS yesterday but there was only so much I could do without the version numbers.

Thanks so much for the tip on the multi-line editor in TES5Edit. I'm sorry to say I find CK pretty cumbersome for doing this kind of edit. One of these days I'll find the time to get more used to it.Anyhow, with the version number in the description, I think it's important to mention that the version string must be contiguous - in other words, there cannot be any spaces. So, for example "Version: 1.2 DGDB" in the plugin's description field shows up as Version 1.2 in BOSS or LOOT, but "Version: 1.2DGDB" comes through as Version 1.2DGDB. Now I do have a question for you, since you're quite a bit deeper in your knowledge of LOOT: From what I understand, LOOT's algorithm will look at the listed masters for any plugin, to make sure that it gets placed after all listed masters, but it doesn't take the order of masters into consideration - is that right? This creates a bit a problem when creating compatibility patch plugins, because what records need to get forwarded to the patch can often depend completely on the load order of the two (or more) mods that the patch is built for.  For example, one of the patches for AOS 2 provides compatibility with Realistic Water Two, but it's only needed if AOS loads before RWT, which is what BOSS will do (they're both in the masterlist,) but it's possible that LOOT may reverse that load order. In that case, the user doesn't need the patch at all. But then, when you're making a patch that has a mix of records that don't need to be forwarded in one load order, but do in the other, and vice-versa - I really have no idea how to properly handle that, if I'm trying to make a patch that will "work" for everyone out there. Are these the kinds of things that need to addressed in the global metadata masterlist (sorry if I'm using the wrong term there) that LOOT downloads and updates for everyone? Personally, I should add, I think in an ideal world, everyone would learn how to use TES5Edit to its full potential and make their own patches. I do that myself, which is why I've gotten into helping out with compatibility patches. Of course it's much more complicated than that, because things can refer to scripts, and scripts from one mod may overwrite another, etc., plus understanding the function of all those records / sub-record types helps, of course, too. 

I wanted to point out that michaelrw used to offer a Skyre Patch Patch, intended to be used by those who used qotsafan's patches. I can confirm it still works nicely with xathra's patches, therefore it should also be included in the fomod imo :)

There's already a SkyRe patch included in the new AOS 2.1 installer. However, on that patch, I didn't download it and install it to check it, so I'm not sure if it's the same one you're referring to.

[Gekko64]

yeah, the skyre patch makes AOS compatible with SkyRe and it's included. the one I'm talking about is called Skyre Patch Patch, and it used to go below qotsafan miscellaneous patch at the bottom of the load order. qotsafan's patch is now obsoleted by xathra's work, but the Skyre Patch Patch still works fine. it's here, from michaelrw page: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/download/1000076353

 

edit: it's actually called skyre after patch now, doesn't matter. same CRC, it's the same file. double checked in tes5edit just to be sure.

Edited May 3, 2014 by Gekko64

[EssArrBee]

@keithinhanoi  Do you have any plans to do the Smooth Blade Draw & Sheathe patch over again?

[keithinhanoi]

@keithinhanoi  Do you have any plans to do the Smooth Blade Draw & Sheathe patch over again?

 

I had been using Smooth Blade Draw & Sheathe, and when AOS 2 came out, I looked into it and found out that there's just no way that they can both be used.AOS 2 now tries to do most of the same things as Smooth Blade Draw & Sheathe, except for the sneak sound reduction feature provided by ADS.esp - but even that plugin has enough conflicts with changes in AOS that you would have to completely change the ADS plugin until it's no longer using the sounds of Smooth Blade Draw & Sheathe - and I'm quite sure the author wouldn't like that to be uploaded and shared anywhere.I'm sorry to say that if AOS will continue to be featured in STEP, then dropping Smooth Blade Draw & Sheathe should be considered - because of the numerous conflicts.Please check your PM from me on Nexus for some more details, by the way.

 

yeah, the skyre patch makes AOS compatible with SkyRe and it's included. the one I'm talking about is called Skyre Patch Patch, and it used to go below qotsafan miscellaneous patch at the bottom of the load order. qotsafan's patch is now obsoleted by xathra's work, but the Skyre Patch Patch still works fine. it's here, from michaelrw page: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/download/1000076353 edit: it's actually called skyre after patch now, doesn't matter. same CRC, it's the same file. double checked in tes5edit just to be sure.

 

A patch for a patch??? Sorry, but that sounds really odd.

 

Anyhow, I'll check it out by downloading the one from michaelrw's patch page, but the most that will happen is it will just get stuck, as is, into the AOS all-in-one installer when it's updated to be BAIN / Wyre Bash compatible.

 

I don't use SkyRe, and don't want to spend the extra time right now to see if the two patches could be more smartly combined - my weekend is almost a total loss because of all the work!

Edited May 4, 2014 by keithinhanoi

[Gekko64]

they cannot be smartly combined. and adding it to the archive is indeed all that's needed. the only thing I'd do is update the readme so that it states it's supposed to load after Xathra's Post Reproccer patches.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Gekko64

[keithinhanoi]

they cannot be smartly combined. and adding it to the archive is indeed all that's needed. the only thing I'd do is update the readme so that it states it's supposed to load after Xathra's Post Reproccer patches. 

Yup, I figured out all of that - needs to be after the ReProcc patch, and that's the only way to do it.

 

The one on michaelrw's page still seems to be fine, but I have stuck it into the new updated AOS 2.1 installer I'm working on that's almost ready. I did add author info and description in the plugin header so it can be matched to metadata tags if using LOOT.

 

In fact I've added a version number line in the description of ALL plugins in the new installer, following egocarib's advice. They're all at Version: 2.1, and any variants of a plugin with the same name have alpha characters to indicate which variant you've got installed. For example "Version: 2.1DG" or "Version: 2.1noDLC". I sincerely hope that helps!

 

Also all the read me files have be extensively re-done and improved, including notes about BOSS versus LOOT load order, and they do have a special note for any patches which aren't necessary if the load order is "reversed" from the one that was used when the patch was created.

 

Some other patches have been added, including those for Deadly Spell Impacts, Improved Weapon Impact EFFECTS Correct Metal, the above mentioned SkyRe "AFTER" patch, and a new merged patch for people using both Fire & Ice Overhaul and the Traps are Dangerous plugin from kryptopyr's Traps Make Noise - More Dangerous Traps mod.

 

Most importantly, the updated installer will be fully BAIN Wizard compatible for all the Wyre Bash lovers out there. A big big thank you to alt3rn1ty for help in creating the wizard.txt code that I could then edit. 

 

So, yay! I know know how to make FOMOD and BAIN installers, what fun!

 

Expect it to be available in the next day or two.

[Gekko64]

well done, thanks for the good work!

[Spock]

 

I'm sorry to say that if AOS will continue to be featured in STEP, then dropping Smooth Blade Draw & Sheathe should be considered - because of the numerous conflicts.

I personally prefer the AOS sounds. I did a little test with my sword, they just sound realistic (like pretty much everything else in AOS).

One thing that could be considered is installing it without any esp before AOS just for the spell sheath sounds.

[EssArrBee]

SBD&S seems to cover a lot more sounds that AOS does for sheathe sounds. I count 7 conflicts total in the plugins. That wouldn't be a deal breaker for me, but I would say if AOS sound files conflict then let AOS overwrite. One of the problems is the output model is higher for AOS in though conflicts, so SBD&S sounds may not sound correct. If AOS starts including more of those weapon sounds covered by SBD&S then maybe I'd see that SBD&S was no longer usable. I haven't ever noticed anything wrong with them, but I don't play Skyrim enough to notice.

[keithinhanoi]

SBD&S seems to cover a lot more sounds that AOS does for sheathe sounds. I count 7 conflicts total in the plugins. That wouldn't be a deal breaker for me, but I would say if AOS sound files conflict then let AOS overwrite. One of the problems is the output model is higher for AOS in though conflicts, so SBD&S sounds may not sound correct. If AOS starts including more of those weapon sounds covered by SBD&S then maybe I'd see that SBD&S was no longer usable. I haven't ever noticed anything wrong with them, but I don't play Skyrim enough to notice.

 

I suppose, but there would definitely need to be a clear disclaimer about how AOS will affect the SBD&S sounds that don't get priority overwritten, and also the whole bit about what to expect if the ADS plugin is used. One of the hallmark features of AOS is an attempt to bring consistency to the weapon sounds, and using SBD&S will have an affect on that.

 

Time to put it up for discussion, anyhow - that's what you guys are so good at, right?

[DoubleYou]

Also, I drew my sword the other day, and found that evidently because of Animated Weapon Enchants in combination with AOS, I had the sound of a mighty rushing wind as if a dragon was landing beside me. Not sure though if that simply wasn't because I didn't have my patches active or not.