Lexy's: Legacy of The Dragonborn Special Edition

[Shadriss]

Hi Guys!  I'm still using my old savegame and I wonder if I can use the Experience Mod with the Immersive creature patch... (I try yesterday and saw that the one I downloaded was for the new skse for the 1.50.53 and it crash. So I removed it and downloaded the older one for the 1.5.50 with the patch for Immersive Creature until the next guide update.

 

I'm planning to use it with my current save and as other have said with the Kill option + multiplier 2.0x... Just want to know if you think I'll encounter issues or not ? Will it change a lot the progression ? In brief, is it OK?

You can drop in Experience any time you feel like it, and it should be fine. There is no ESP files to worry about, so it can also be removed at will. I'm not sure I would drop it in in a very advanced game like yours though, simply from the standpoint that if you are that far into your game, it wouldn't make a lot of sense to change the base mechanic you've been playing with to that point. Even so, you could, and there would be little to no issues from the technical stand point.

 

The discussion regarding what it's balanced for is kind of null and void, however. This is not a 'balance' mod, so to speak - it doesn't rely on there being only so many things to do, or weapons and armors available, and so forth, for it's settings. It simply removes skill advancement as the mechanic for level advancement, and replaces it with a set XP value for doing certain things. I have personally left it at default values (minus kill XP, which is turned on and set to 2X gain) after playing with it in two previous playthroughs, and it feels right to me. YMMV.

 

I've been playing with JK for awhile and it's hard to go back, the towns feel bland. I honestly would remove ICAIO before I'd remove JK, however it's so heavily built into this guide that's not really possible. The compatibility issues don't seem very large.

 

JK's skyrim claims "Immersive Citizens - Partially Compatible. Possible NPC pathing issues in Falkreath and Rorikstead and clipping in Dawnstar"

The pathing is the biggest issue, yes, and as I mention, there is a small team on the Discord who are working through these issues (and others) to create a version of it that I believe is destined for inclusion in the guide. I agree that the main cities are pretty bland... and that is being worked on. Patience will yield us yet another substantial improvement on vanilla Skyrim - hold on!

 

In regards the step about installing LotD patches, when the FOMOD(?) gets to 'Overhaul Systems' the guide has 'none'.  It should be 'Morrowloot Ultimate'.

 

Which brings up a criticism of mine...  their is no logical order of progression.  At this point of my install, following the guide pretty closely, if I enable all of the files in the right pane of MO2 I have something like ~70 advisories / warnings when I run loot.  SkyrimSE won't load for testing until I un-enable most of those.  (Yes, I am a fairly experienced modder...  so I know about doing that...)  IFF you ever intend for this guide to be accepted by Joe Bloggs as a guide, some thought needs to be given to the organization.  Or, again...if this is only ever to be aimed at 'Leet' modders, then why bother?   Bragging rights?

It is not aimed at 'Leet' modders. It is aimed at 'experienced' modders, which is stated quite clearly at the top of the guide's main page. That said, a large number of people who are unfamiliar with the tools still use the guide, and the team (and a few others like myself) do try to help out where we can when questions are asked.

 

The biggest thing to understand about this particular guide is that Lexy (and team) do most of the Conflict Resolution for us (which is what most of the patches we are NOT using from FOMOD installers are for), and so we have no need of those files. There has been one missed on occasion that should have been used (maybe two since I started using this guide as a baseline back in July), but for the most part, there is, as Lexy would say, "a method to my madness"... it's deliberate. Most of those errors that you see can be safely ignored for now, many will be gone by the time the guide is assembled. Those that remain are ignorable, and are of no consequence. This latest version, using OMEGA, has been the most stable mod build I've ever used... it's complicated to get set up, and I do run into questions every so often, but it is doable, and the instructions (though, I agree, sometimes hard to understand the reasoning) do work, and will get you a very fun place to tromp around in.

 

I get your frustration - really, I do. Most of us who go through the guide the first time experience it. A little patience, though, will get you to the end, and I'm pretty sure you'll be satisfied with the results.

[madskyrim]

In the last update of Guide, the following entries were made:

 

• Main Guide - Location Section - Unique Border Gates SE - Remove Conversion Instructions for Unique Border Gates All - Point The Way - Patch
• Main Guide - Eyes Section - Improved Eyes Skyrim - Simplified Special Installation Instructions

 

If I already have them installed as per previous 10/10/2018 installation - do I need to download/reinstall ?

 

[DarkladyLexy]

In the last update of Guide, the following entries were made:

 

• Main Guide - Location Section - Unique Border Gates SE - Remove Conversion Instructions for Unique Border Gates All - Point The Way - Patch
• Main Guide - Eyes Section - Improved Eyes Skyrim - Simplified Special Installation Instructions

 

If I already have them installed as per previous 10/10/2018 installation - do I need to download/reinstall ?

no, if you have already downloaded and installed nothing has changed it just we longer need to convert  Unique Border Gates All - Point The Way - Patch as Wrye Bash no longer complains about it and Improved eyes was just to simplify what files to remove.

[bigmagicjerk]

I thought the guide was very concise and easy to follow. I can't believe I built a mod installation of this size in 3 days. I've been running around and using console COC trying to cause a CTD and I haven't been able to do it. This has got to be the most stable I have ever seen a post modded Skyrim. Please accept my gratitude. 

[Shadriss]

Please accept my gratitude. 

I'd say offer her your firstborn, but that already belongs to Sheson (for you DynDOLOD usage), and Lexy already has children that make her life hard interesting, so she likely doesn't want another one anyhow. Money is also out, so I guess gratitude will have to do. :)

[tyrindor]

Currently, I'm playing with Experience AND Level Rate Rebalence (with my "old" character started at the previous build, no problem with that) and the levelling experience is far superior to vanilla IMO, I encourage everyone to try it.

 

However I'm not a very experienced Skyrim player and I can't really tell if the levelling curve (I'm using "Slow and steady" atm) need some adjustments or not.

I suggest "slow down" preset over "slow and steady". For the main reason that Slow and steady will have you shooting through higher levels just as fast as lower levels. At level 100 it's effectively 1/6th the XP needed over the vanilla curve which will probably become an issue if you plan on playing a long time on a single character. Slow down preset makes 1-20 take about 2x longer and only barely touches 20+.

 

Ideally we could make our own leveling curve for the pack that's based around experience mod. I hear it's pretty easy to do in the CK.

 

 

The pathing is the biggest issue, yes, and as I mention, there is a small team on the Discord who are working through these issues (and others) to create a version of it that I believe is destined for inclusion in the guide. I agree that the main cities are pretty bland... and that is being worked on. Patience will yield us yet another substantial improvement on vanilla Skyrim - hold on!

 

Awesome to hear, I can't wait for this to go 1.0

Edited October 10, 2018 by tyrindor

[thecrazyjoe]

 

I suggest "slow down" preset over "slow and steady". For the main reason that Slow and steady will have you shooting through higher levels just as fast as lower levels. At level 100 it's effectively 1/6th the XP needed over the vanilla curve which will probably become an issue if you plan on playing a long time on a single character. Slow down preset makes 1-20 take about 2x longer and only barely touches 20+.

 

Ideally we could make our own leveling curve for the pack that's based around experience mod. I hear it's pretty easy to do in the CK.

 

 

 

Awesome to hear, I can't wait for this to go 1.0

 

You're right, that's what I figured out too and now I run a custom leveling curve in "Level Rebalence" (275+x*20, moderately slower than vanilla until lvl 40/faster thereafter  instead of "slow and steady" 500+x*5) with kill and misc quest xp ON in "Experience", hoping to find a good balance for a steady and "organic" classic RPG  progression.

Edited October 10, 2018 by thecrazyjoe

[tyrindor]

You're right, that's what I figured out too and now I run a custom leveling curve in "Level Rebalence" (275+x*20, moderately slower until lvl 40/faster thereafter  instead of "slow and steady" 500+x*5) with kill and misc quest xp ON in "Experience", hoping to find a good balance for a steady and "organic" classic RPG  progression.

I think it'll end up being preference. I think it should vastly slow down at higher levels because the game has a sweet spot and it's around level 30-60 in my opinion. I think something like 300+x*10 or 300+x*15 might work well. How did you make it in the CK by the way?

 

What did you set Misc Quest XP to and how is it working for you? It says "for testing purposes only" so skeptical to enable it. I was gonna just set it to something low like 20 XP so misc quests don't feel as worthless.

 

Another thing to note is, might want to go into the OMEGA AIO and adjust the uncapper INI. No point in having skills go past 100 when you have experience installed, the formula is capped at 100 in this guide anyway.

Edited October 10, 2018 by tyrindor

[thecrazyjoe]

Just open the Level Rebalence esp with SSEEdit and you'll find "fxPLevelUpBase" and "fxPLevelMult" variables.

 

I set misc to 50 and it's working as intended, according to the FAQ "Other mods use these quests to hold their script based systems and they are often being silently completed in the background 

    (they don’t show middle of screen notification, but the game still detects them as real quest completions)." but that didn't seems to be the case with any mod of this setup (I didn't seen any "50 xp gained" poping up out of nowhere in several hours of testing).

[bigmagicjerk]

Can you combine that skill leveling rate of the Skyrim Uncapper with Experience and Level Rate Rebalance? An idea is peculating in my mind... I'm betting we could extract a list of quests out of our mod list via a script, sort by encounter zone, and then re-balance leveling and skill rate gains contingent on the total quests available within each level range.

You could, hypothetically speaking, aim for completion of ~80% of the quests for a given level range before being sufficiently powerful enough to progress to the next area - similar to how Blizzard designs progression for their WoW content.

 

That way you would experience progression throughout the entirety of your play through. 

 

Hmm

[tyrindor]

Can you combine that skill leveling rate of the Skyrim Uncapper with Experience and Level Rate Rebalance? An idea is peculating in my mind... I'm betting we could extract a list of quests out of our mod list via a script, sort by encounter zone, and then re-balance leveling and skill rate gains contingent on the total quests available within each level range.

 

You could, hypothetically speaking, aim for completion of ~80% of the quests for a given level range before being sufficiently powerful enough to progress to the next area - similar to how Blizzard designs progression for their WoW content.

 

That way you would experience progression throughout the entirety of your play through. 

 

Hmm

Yes, all those work together. I slow skill leveling way down but make it more of a linear curve using uncapper. Hitting skill level 100 so fast, especially with deleveled zones and XP tied to quests and exploration, just leads to a quicker boring endgame IMO. I boost my caps to 125 and make 100-125 take a very long time to keep a endgame sense of progression.

 

A target of 80% completed quests would be rather high. I wager most people won't even touch 50% of the content this pack offers before starting a new character or quitting. It'd take probably 1000 hours to do everything in this pack, and you'd probably run into the gamebreaking vanilla bug after visiting more than 4096 zones. I think the best solution is to leave Experience mod values at their defaults but Enable Kill XP and set misc quest XP to something low (I'm gonna use 25), then increase the curve itself using Level Rate Rebelance + SSEedit. Testing would need to be done but right now 1-10 is way too fast using experience + default curve in my opinion. 

 

Let's look at setting experience to 300+(L*25):

Level 1 would now be 300 XP versus 100 XP.

Level 50 would now be 1550 XP versus 1325 XP.

Level 100 would now be 2800 XP versus 2575 XP.

 

This keeps the stock vanilla leveling curve of L*25, while making it so early levels aren't so fast. But is it slowed down enough? Since we enable Kill/Misc Quest XP, and have a lot more quests and areas to explore, we will naturally still be leveling much faster than the experience mod author intended.

 

Let's look at 300+(L*30):

Level 1 would now be 300 XP versus 100 XP.

Level 50 would now be 1800 XP versus 1325 XP.

Level 100 would now be 3300 XP versus 2575 XP.

 

The early levels won't be much slower than they were with 300+(L*25), however the later levels will slow down more to help prevent over leveling. Again though, is it slowed down enough given we are enabling extra XP and have so much more content?

 

Let's take it even a step further and go with 300+(L*35) which would look like this:

Level 1 would now be 300 XP versus 100 XP.

Level 50 would now be 2050 XP versus 1325 XP.

Level 100 would now be 3800 XP versus 2575 XP.

 

I feel that looks better. That allows us to get XP from kills and misc quests without leveling too fast, and slows it down enough to help make up for the fact we have a lot more content to do. It should hopefully offer a "real" RPG-like experience. My biggest concern is if we level too slow, we could be forced into doing content we don't want to do (or grinding mobs). I think we'd have to slow it down much further for that to happen though.

 

If someone doesn't want to mess around in SSEedit here are the files I made for testing (You don't need the original Level Rate Rebalanced mod):

300+(L*25): https://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=06693669677303588852

300+(L*30): https://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=90669941849371898883

300+(L*35): https://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=66142344797591327809

 

Here's my personal uncapper preset (WIP) : https://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=11995438338031416091

(Designed for experience mod with significantly slower skill leveling and long term playing in mind!)

 

No idea how this will all play out in the actual game yet. All theories and rough math at this point.

Edited October 10, 2018 by tyrindor

[tyrindor]

Testing further. Not sure enabling Misc Quest XP is ideal. Looking at Sofia follower, some of her scripts seem to run as misc quests. You can see them by typing "help sofia" in the console window. I'm sure there are many others, which is why the experience mod author has it enabled by default. It doesn't seem to give an XP popup either, so you are just getting hidden XP in the background.

 

Might be better to only enable Kill XP. Sucks you wont get XP for misc quests, but then again you wouldn't in Vanilla either.

Edited October 11, 2018 by tyrindor

[thecrazyjoe]

Testing further. Not sure enabling Misc Quest XP is ideal. Looking at Sofia follower, some of her scripts seem to run as misc quests. You can see them by typing "help sofia" in the console window. I'm sure there are many others, which is why the experience mod author has it enabled by default. It doesn't seem to give an XP popup either, so you are just getting hidden XP in the background.

 

Might be better to only enable Kill XP. Sucks you wont get XP for misc quests, but then again you wouldn't in Vanilla either.

Funny thing it happened just after I read your post: 50xp popping out of nowhere (with notification), too bad we can't rely on that fonctionality.

 

Regarding the "4036 cells" bug there's a possible workaround here: https://www.reddit.com/r/EnaiRim/comments/9k21so/enairim_and_the_ability_condition_bug/

[AthlonAI]

Id you have another HD you can do a simlink to it and moved all your files to the other HD without problems. You mignt have a steam folder and a Mod Organizer folder (you can moved the biggest one only and keep your steam folder where it is as it's smaller. Here is the procedure :

1. Move your complete folder "Mod Orgamizer" to drive "D:" or "whatever drive letter"
2. Now, open a console command in administrator mod (Right click the shortcut "Command Prompt" in windows accessories on the windows menu and click "run as administratior"
3. now make sure you are on the root of your C: drive ( or whatever other place your original folder was)... the command is "cd.." you might have to do it a few time to get to "C:\"
4. Now you have to perform the command to create the link which is : mklink /d "c:\Mod Organizer 2" "d:\Mod Organizer 2"
5. This will create a simlink folder in the c: drive and when you click on it, it will go inside the same folde rin the D: drive but it will be interpreted by the OS as still in the C: drive...

Hope this help.

 

I've just done a test with the mklink command having the old (not really!) Skyrim Legendary Edition with the DarthMathias guide and the only thing not working is the FNIS (Fores New Idle)... That sad because I was kinda sure that it would work but apparently FNIS dont use the Universal Naming Convention (UNC - which is Drive letter than folder, etc.). So maybe you have to point the mod organizer settings location to be on the other drive not the same and don't use the mklink...

[AthlonAI]

You can drop in Experience any time you feel like it, and it should be fine. There is no ESP files to worry about, so it can also be removed at will. I'm not sure I would drop it in in a very advanced game like yours though, simply from the standpoint that if you are that far into your game, it wouldn't make a lot of sense to change the base mechanic you've been playing with to that point. Even so, you could, and there would be little to no issues from the technical stand point.

 

The discussion regarding what it's balanced for is kind of null and void, however. This is not a 'balance' mod, so to speak - it doesn't rely on there being only so many things to do, or weapons and armors available, and so forth, for it's settings. It simply removes skill advancement as the mechanic for level advancement, and replaces it with a set XP value for doing certain things. I have personally left it at default values (minus kill XP, which is turned on and set to 2X gain) after playing with it in two previous playthroughs, and it feels right to me. YMMV.

Thanks shadriss for the info on experience mod. Even If you think I'm quite far, I have just done some of the mods quests (like bruma) and a few towns quests... I'm still at the very beginning of the main quest and it was to build-up my character. Knowing the guide was still in beta, I don't mind continuing using my current character and make modifications... I'll go for those setting until the official setting version of Experience comes in and the testers have figure out what are the best one...