Quick auto clean seem to remove itm navmesh which actually is different from master

[sodakdale]

Reproduce:

1. Download this mod's main file :https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/9666?tab=files&BH=38

2. Install it anyway(though it's fomod it only contains one esp)

3. Quick auto clean it

Then sseedit will log 34 itms are removed. There are a lot navmesh like NAVM:001020DA NAVM:000FEDD9 from the mrissi mod being removed.

While you check these navmesh using uncleaned esp by sseedit, you will find they are colored as yellow and some data in it is actually different from skyrim.esm. 2 or 3 Triangles （and only one or two hex number in them are different）, edge links are different and in yellow color.

I don't know much about how navmesh works. The question is, is this the correct way to clean it? They seem to be edited by the mod author. Or these should just be regarded as itm?

[Mousetick]

9 hours ago, sodakdale said:

While you check these navmesh using uncleaned esp by sseedit, you will find they are colored as yellow and some data in it is actually different from skyrim.esm. 2 or 3 Triangles （and only one or two hex number in them are different）, edge links are different and in yellow color.

Which autocleaned navmeshes exactly don't look like ITMs to you? Please provide specific Form IDs.

The 2 you mentioned as examples are ITMs indeed: 001020DA and 000FEDD9. They're not colored yellow in xEdit.

9 hours ago, sodakdale said:

I don't know much about how navmesh works. The question is, is this the correct way to clean it? They seem to be edited by the mod author. Or these should just be regarded as itm?

Yes it's the correct way. No the navmeshes that are removed by autocleaning are not edited by the mod author. They're a completely identical duplicate of the original navmesh in Skyrim.esm, which is why they're removed. If you are seeing differences, you probably are not looking at the correct records in xEdit.

[sodakdale]

2 hours ago, Mousetick said:

Which autocleaned navmeshes exactly don't look like ITMs to you? Please provide specific Form IDs.

The 2 you mentioned as examples are ITMs indeed: 001020DA and 000FEDD9. They're not colored yellow in xEdit.

Please look at these. Don't know why these are different from skyrim.esm. And the auto clean do report Removing: [NAVM:001020DA] (in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of [CELL:00009A1C]

Edited January 25, 2023 by sodakdale

[Mousetick]

I don't know what to tell you. This navmesh [NAVM:001020DA] is an ITM and is displayed as such in xEdit:

With 'Hide no conflict and empty rows' option turned on:

What is 'MrissiTailOfTroubles_test.esp' in your screenshot? The original, genuine plugin name of Mrissi version 1.7 for SSE is MrissiTailOfTroubles.esp with checksum 881934D2, as reported by xEdit:

[00:08] Background Loader: loading "MrissiTailOfTroubles.esp"...
[00:08] Background Loader: [MrissiTailOfTroubles.esp] Loading file
[00:08] Background Loader: [MrissiTailOfTroubles.esp] File loaded (CRC32:881934D2)

Seems to me you're not looking at the correct plugin in xEdit.

[sodakdale]

11 hours ago, Mousetick said:

Seems to me you're not looking at the correct plugin in xEdit.

the _test esp is the one I just downloaded from nexusmod and renamed it. It's the same as MrissiTailOfTroubles.esp except for its name. I did so since the esp currently used is edited in many ways.

The checksum of it is actually the same as yours: Background Loader: [MrissiTailOfTroubles_test.esp] File loaded (CRC32:881934D2)

From your screenshot in record 001020DA, seems like the data size (6187 vs 6184) and form version (40 vs 44) are also different for skyrim.esm and MrissiTailOfTroubles.esp. So I guess still they are different but sseedit did not report it?

Edited January 26, 2023 by sodakdale

[sodakdale]

Or it's because I used a different skyrim.esm? I used 1.5.97 and skyrim.esm crc32 is shown as A528BAFA. I don't know about this algorithm and how reliable it is.

Besides I used 4.0.3 sseedit.

[Mousetick]

1 hour ago, sodakdale said:

From your screenshot in record 001020DA, seems like the data size (6187 vs 6184) and form version (40 vs 44) are also different for skyrim.esm and MrissiTailOfTroubles.esp. So I guess still they are different but sseedit did not report it?

The record structures holding the data in the plugins are slightly different between the 2 plugins, but the data within are identical, hence it is considered an ITM by xEdit. When viewing records, xEdit highlights only the differences that actually matter. Form version doesn't matter in determining whether records are different or identical. The size difference is a byproduct of the different form versions.

35 minutes ago, sodakdale said:

Or it's because I used a different skyrim.esm? I used 1.5.97 and skyrim.esm crc32 is shown as A528BAFA. I don't know about this algorithm and how reliable it is.

CRC32 is reliable to verify the integrity of files. It's specifically designed to detect errors in data storage or transmission.

The CRC32 of my copy of Skyrim.esm from 1.5.97 is AF75991D. The CRC32 of Skyrim.esm from 1.6.640 (current Steam version) is 66212483. Navmesh 001020DA in MrissiTailOfTroubles.esp is seen as an ITM when compared with either version.

42 minutes ago, sodakdale said:

Besides I used 4.0.3 sseedit.

The current version of SSEdit is 4.0.4.

I finally found out the reason you're seeing navmesh "differences" in xEdit, highlighted in yellow/green: you're using 'Simple records'. You need to turn this option off to properly visualize and compare NAVM records and other complex records:

Bottom line: these navmeshes are definitely ITMs and are correctly cleaned/removed from the Mrissi plugin.

[sodakdale]

29 minutes ago, Mousetick said:

I finally found out the reason you're seeing navmesh "differences" in xEdit, highlighted in yellow/green: you're using 'Simple records'. You need to turn this option off to properly visualize and compare NAVM records and other complex records:

 

Thanks so much for all the patient debugging!!! I disable this option and now it will show no conflict. I once saw somewhere that this option should be turned off: https://lexyslotd.com/guide/prerequisites/ but I did not realize what it does. Thanks!

31 minutes ago, Mousetick said:

The CRC32 of my copy of Skyrim.esm from 1.5.97 is AF75991D. The CRC32 of Skyrim.esm from 1.6.640 (current Steam version) is 66212483. Navmesh 001020DA in MrissiTailOfTroubles.esp is seen as an ITM when compared with either version.

Ok, I think it must be I used cleaned esm from others' and the version is definitely not 1.5.97. I need to recover all these files. Lucky to know this through this 'bug':)

Another thing to ask, could you please also share the crc for other dlc esm in 1.5.97? Just need the crc for the cleaned esm for reference. I think previously I removed all backup and I need to redownload everything and downgrade them. Thanks again for keeping tracking this.

[sodakdale]

Well luckily again before I redownload I found this page http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Special_Edition_Patch . It contains a detailed changelog about 1.5.97. Seems like my esm is 1.5.97. Anyway skyrim is the toughest game I ever played even for so many years, still much to learn from there.

[Mercury71]

3 hours ago, sodakdale said:

Well luckily again before I redownload I found this page http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Special_Edition_Patch . It contains a detailed changelog about 1.5.97. Seems like my esm is 1.5.97. Anyway skyrim is the toughest game I ever played even for so many years, still much to learn from there.

Why dont you play the latest version?