GrandBulwark

Now now Aiyen, you know Skyrim is COMPLETELY reflective of real life and if Bethesda say that a big boat can sail in a small creek; who are we to argue?   JK of course! I hope you find a stable location.  I would help you my friend, but I cannot replicate the issue anymore. :(  Kinda sad that Skyrim is stable when I want crashes and crashes when I want stable. It's the aliens I'm sure! It seems like it may be something that the game has to load, like a script activator there on the docks. Do we know what takes place there? I know there are a few side quests in that area. Perhaps someone could test the issue by completing the quest for the argonian lady, and anything else in that immediate area. I wish I could be more specific, but it's been a while since I help argoninans for charity! Also have we considered that this could be an LOD/texture/mesh loading issue.  Perhaps one we all share?  I know Vurt's Flora Overhaul causes ILSs in Markarth for SOME people without the 2048 tree lods for the corresponding version.  It did not cause that issue for me, which is in line with the general inconsistency of the issue here.  Some have it, some had it and lost it and some people can't replicate the issue at all.

It is an inconsistent issue. Â The more I come across reports of it, the more inconsistent the solutions. Â This support the threading issue that Altimor is working on and MontyMM pointed out. Â I would suggest leaving you mod list alone and COCing to an alternate location until we're able to solve this riddle. Â I already invested 5-6 hours trying to fix it, maybe more.Â

1. I cannot reproduce the issue anymore 2. I Follow my guide, or rather myself whatever :) 3a.The mods I've individually and jointly tested for incompatibility w/ Wet and Cold are as follows: 3b. Complete mod list: 4. Issue is no longer present with or without ENB. 5.Yes to COT 6.No Lighting Mods Skyrim.ini Skyrimpref.ini Ini info, testing was done with shadows set to 4096, primary and secondary. And logging was on but didn't yield anything relevant.

Well said, summarizes my entirety of my concerns. Â Even if the same thing were posted on the Nexus, I would be very Skeptical simply due to the fact that I was under the impression all FNV mods and utilities were entirely worthless to Skyrim. Â At which point I would think that, if you had the skills to update the program to work for Skyrim, why not make an entirely new one that has a unique code. Â Granted that would likely be harder, but it would also be the correct way to approach the issue to my mind.

Hmmm. Â That is very interesting. Â Definitely worth tracking and I hope he is successful. Â Thank you for the clarification Monty!

Would you like to install the bingbamboombarofdeathandcheesewafers? Why YES Windows, while I'm at it how about I shove a fork up your PSU!!!! :@ LMFAO

They do that is very strange indeed! Anyone reading this with UAC disabled, TURN IT ON!!!! I agree with your scenario 100% What is even more commonplace is developers bundling useless RAM hogging crap with legitimate useful programs. Sometimes they're malicious, but more often their just useless crap that starts by default when you boot up. Not only is it bundled in their; it exploits the fact that most end users don't give a crap where or what's installed and they just click straight through the installer. Not necessarily related; but that is just as bad to my mind as your scenario.

That's great, you can verify that Stable Ugrids is NOT a placebo effect then? Â The reason I ask is because I read some time ago a post by Arthmoor in which he suggested the end result would be.

https://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/42662 From the author of deadly dragons; this mod adds an MCM menu that allows you to configure the loot that enemies drop. Â It's fairly self explanatory but the coolest feature appears to be that there is an option for "Epic Armor" with unique names. The configuration options are fairly in depth. Â There is currently no configuration option for clothing, and while the armor has a unique "epic" parameter; the weapons do not as of yet. Looks very promising! Now who is going to test it with me? ;)

Alright. I am back with little to nothing to show for my time. Here is the long and short of it. I tested twenty mods individually with all the DLCs, SkyUI and X mod being enabled (X of course being the mod in question at the time. Prior to this, I was able to replicate the ILS twice with my entire load order. The test was similar to my first I would load up on a save dependent only on the DLCs and SkyUI, with X being loaded for the first time each test, on the boat in Solstheim. I would then repeat the same steps in the old test, run and save captain Valeth and then return to the boat to fast travel. I could provide the list of mods I tested but it's largely irrelevant considering my results, if anyone wants the list feel free to ask. Twenty separate times I repeated this process and the results were all exactly the same, mind you there are more than 20 .esps I just lumped mods that go together in the same test. EG. Immersive Patrols all plugins together, all the unofficial patches together etc. In any case, I was able to complete each loading screen successfully with NO ILSs. Now here is where the results get a bit, weird... I enabled all the mods for this cross referenced list I created and patched ASIS to the modlist and I ran the text once more without issue. Sorry I was wrong, here's the weird part AFTER that I enabled everything in my mod list, patched ASIS and then ran the test again. To my amazement I completed it by arriving at the windhelm docks. So I ran it again, same results... That could support Monty's point made above about poor threading during cell load. Though I cannot be certain of that. Another alternative is that when I repatched ASIS to reflect my original test load order last night, it misfired somehow. I'm not sure if that is probable but I'm sure it's possible. Other Relevant Info: Wet and Cold brings my mods list to 94, no cloaking scripts are present in my load order other than Wet and Cold and possibly DVA (Dynamic Vampire Appearance) Though I believe that is only if you are a vampire. There may be another that escapes me but I'm not an advocate of scripts attached to the player reference in general. TES5EDIT reports that Wet and Cold overwrites info from ONLY the Skyrim.ESM, and the Ashes plugin overwrites parts of Wet and Cold, Solstheim Climate overhaul and Climates of Tamriel. Nothing to be concerned with as far as basic compatibility with other mods. Of course I cannot examine the scripts; I'm not a scripter. Also, papyrus logging shows no errors for wet and cold at the time of the preliminary test in which I had an ILS; nor do any errors show up in any of the subsequent testing. Conclusion: There is none; only more questions... To summarize it is either related to an infrequent script that causes the errors or, as Monty mentioned a threading issue on load. In either case the problem seems to be largely inconsistent. Which is of course enough for me to remove the mod; although NOT enough for me to suggest removal to anyone who isn't experiencing issues. It will remain on my "Blacklist" and off my mod list; though I regret that deeply. I would love to see the mod stabilized to a greater extent. On that note, I may have a light at the end of that particular tunnel. I was on the Nexus chat last night and I spoke with Tytanis briefly. He claims to be working on a mod that he calls "Papyrus+" and while he didn't go into great detail he did state that it is focused on thread each script. Mind you that is paraphrased, but he claims that it it will fix at least some of the Papyrus downfalls will be fixed. Maybe a pipe dream; though I suppose if anyone could do it, it would be Tytanis. Keep an eye out for that, no ETA unfortunately! Sorry my results did not yield anything more conclusive. I will now add my ENB and see if the problem resurfaces. If so I'll report it and if not you won't hear another word about it. ;)

Also possible. I'm not quite willing to leave it to such an inconclusive result just yet though. There has to be something specifically that is causing these issues. At least that is what my gut tells me, and furthermore it HAS to be a mod that I've had for a while. I had the same issue when wet and cold ashes came out for dragonborn and I simply couldn't resist trying Wet and Cold once more; I just never connect the two until now. I did some mod list trimming afterwords which was more broad and unfortunately included Wet and Cold, therefore testing was not done at that point. My OCD cannot let this stand. Tired though I may be, I will now attempt to test this once more. I've already cross referenced a few more, I will post my results in a ~1 1/2 hours. Note to everyone. Please excuse any grammar errors, I have insomnia recently it seems. That or I drink way too much caffeine! Let the testing begin!!!!

I remove the all of the enb files entirely, backed up my inis and generated new ones with the launcher, then dragged my inis back and replaced the proxies. Actually I've already done the testing despite not having a STEP load order I found another. I tested every single mod individually (Well SkyUI was present for all) in my load order. I've come to two conclusions, one it is NOT based on any single mods interaction, therefore it is likely a combination. Two the crash can only be replicated after killing a few ash spawns, repetitious fast traveling/ boat riding does nothing unless you've spent some time is the solstheim worldspace. Which was also suggested by DoYouEvenModBro. My next step is to disable the mods that are cross referenced from the the one I have from a friend, DoYouEvenModBro's and Ubeogash's. However the results will still be inconclusive, although we should get a better understanding of the scope of the problem and the mods that agitate it. Possible other issues: This may be related to more than just simple mod to mod interaction. I've thought from the beginning it was purely script related, however now that seems evermore likely given that the mod does not cause hangs prior to having time to properly initialize in the Solstheim worldspace. This could also explain the inconsistency between the results. Papyrus logging is my next step, although I doubt it will be very helpful. At first I thought it was the ash plugin and the fact that the decals from it don't exist in Skyrim, but the issue persists with wet and cold alone. Now I'm frustrated; however I refuse to give up here. For now I'm burnt out but I will resume testing this evening. Anyone else who cares to contribute their load order, feel free as long as it under 130 mods and even that's being a bit excessive. The more mods you have the more likely it becomes that other issues exist that are compounded by the issue with wet and cold; thus making your load order largely useless for cross referencing anyway. Unfortunately I cannot use your load order. Â If uninstalling wet and cold didn't help you don't have the same issue. Â Although if all you did was remove the mod (wet and cold+ashes) or deactivate it; your results are reliable anyway as you cannot simply disable a mod like wet and cold, I don't care what Isoku says. Â Aside from this you have 170 plugins, you may have never had the issue. Â And likely you didn't because uninstalling the mods you mentioned solved the problems whereas removal of wet and cold did not. Â The only mod that you mentioned removing that I have personally is Skyfalls; which isn't on this other list that I have, though I will test it again for good measure. Thank you though I don't mean to sound ungrateful or short if I'm coming off that way, been a long test run. :)

You're referring to the ILS not being present without an ENB?  If so, that is incorrect as I currently have NO ENB as of about 4 hours prior to the tests I conducted.  I am still looking for a new ENB but actually I'm liking the vanilla plus hardware effects combo.  It won't last though eventually I will get another! @Anyone else Anyone who can replicate this issue, please PM me your load order so I can cross reference it with mine. I would like to find the compatibility issue with Wet and Cold.

I will test you fix later Aiyen; however I'm interested primarily in the mods compatibility issue both for STEPs benefit and that of the users who may never see this thread, isoku should also be informed. Â Are you willing to PM me your load order so I can cross reference it with mine? Â That way I can hopefully isolate the issue.

Hahaha creepy indeed. Â Though probably not objectionable the utility seems to be incomplete. Â I was also under the impression that most if not all utilities from FNV were not compatible with the more advanced Skyrim. Â Testing will be required of course. Â And of course I will not be the one to go first, I'm not that brave :)

Not to mention crashing SkyUI in certain instances thus causing the game to crash. Â When it comes to ini tweaks less is more. Â That also applies to scripts, especially those of the cloaking or constant variety IMHO. Â No amount of tweaking will allow you to run more scripts than you can run, either remove some strain from the system in general or remove some scripted mods (And start a new save of course) It will save you hours of frustration. Another reason for skepticism, at least for me is the forum post where the tweaks are derived from is secondhand information which to poster hand altered by quote "doubling all the values". Not to mention the age and mixed reviews on the forum itself.

That would be a yes! I agree!

I third that motion councilman Z. Oh and councilman Monty! lol

A better option entirely is to switch texture artists to people who correctly compress their texture and offer performance option. EG. Cabal, Brumbek, Sparrowprince or frozunswaiden to name a few.

I second that.

Or perhaps it is which scripts are running and when... That's a thought anyway. DoYouEvenModBro, could you please send me your load order via PM. Since we're both having that same issue, I would like to test Wet and Cold for incompatibilities so we can isolate the actual culprit(s). That would benefit STEP and Isoku and well everyone who has this issue, it would allow us to choose between the mod(s) rather than just removing Wet and Cold. It would also satisfy my slightly obsessive curiosity.

If I spent any more on my system my wife would eat my heart out. It's quite powerful, more so than most. Have you altered it's default settings in MCM at all? I didn't, I left it at default. Also are you using the latest version of Skyrim and Wet and Cold. How many mods do you have?

That may be true, but if this mod is placing an effect on the player or NPCs like the snowy effect, and DSI comes along and places the burnt effect on the newly dead character, then it could cause a conflict. One is saying cold the other hot and so it could freeze. These type of script conflicts are probably more common than we realize. It is true in fact. Â The fact is a variety of some of the greatest mods available have this downfall. Â If you aren't experiencing the issues, then you will eventually. Â Even the comments section of Wet and Cold has numerous reports of instability and random crashes/freezes/ILSs. Â In light of this I blacklisted that mod some time ago on my personal guide on the Nexus. Â I've caught a LOT of crap over this before. Â The reason being is that although the mod WILL cause problems; up until tonight I could not successfully trace the problem to Wet and Cold, other than by asking users to eliminate likely causes for issues. Users in need of support; are often not the best at reporting back the results, nor is the test controlled enough for me with someone else "at the helm". :) Â The last time(This evening excluded) I used Wet and Cold was long before my guide came out and several short lived times sine (Usually after an update). Â I knew it caused issues, but I didn't really care to test it thoroughly. Â Tonight after coming across this thread, I was curious so I tested it for myself. Here are my findings as posted on the aforementioned thread. That said I've since run another test under the exact same set of circumstances. Test 5, Wet and Cold WITHOUT the ashes plugin: ILS the first attempt to travel back, didn't attempt via console That concludes my testing of that mod I think. Â I've tried it numerous times, but seeing as how I save Miraak for last; I never linked the mod to anything concrete. Â However anecdotal this bit may be I think it bears mentioning. I've had this mod destabilize several load orders personally and I've told everyone who wanted my assistance at the Nexus to remove it. Â JUST the removal of Wet and Cold has stabilized the 3 of the 5 load orders I've worked on with no other steps taken. Â Several of the people who DID manage to stabilize it at the time, returned later to report it. Sorry for the wall of text but I believe in being thorough! :)