Enemies/Followers Not Attacking

[z929669]

SOLUTION: uGrids too high with a heavily-scripted setup. Not all AI was initializing due to engine limitations.

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I am playing a Requiem build, but many types of enemies simply do not attack. I wander into a bandit camp and some of them attack on sight, others ignore me, and still others just stand there and let me kill them. Sabre Cats attack, but wolves do not. Elk walk right up to me. Followers sometimes fail to attack as well. Very glitchy NPC behavior. I suspect my NPC mods, but this should not be happening even with those, so maybe it is some kind of an incompatibility.

 

Any ideas?

 

Here is what I am loading:

 

00  Skyrim.esm
01  Update.esm
02  Dawnguard.esm
03  HearthFires.esm
04  Dragonborn.esm
05  Falskaar.esm
06  ClimatesOfTamriel.esm
07  moonpath.esm
08  SPIKE.esm
09  Unofficial Skyrim Patch.esp  [Version 2.0.1]
0A  Unofficial Dawnguard Patch.esp  [Version 2.0.1]
0B  Unofficial Hearthfire Patch.esp  [Version 2.0.1]
0C  Unofficial Dragonborn Patch.esp  [Version 2.0.1]
0D  Wyrmstooth.esp  [Version 1.10]
0E  Skyrim Project Optimization - Full Version.esp
0F  DSAMG - Miraak Music Fixes.esp
10  Weapons & Armor Fixes_Remade.esp
11  Clothing & Clutter Fixes.esp
12  Improved Closefaced Helmets_Legendary.esp
13  Chesko_Frostfall.esp
14  CCO_Frostfall_Patch.esp
15  ADS.esp
16  AOS.esp
17  IHSS.esp
18  Improved Combat Sounds v2.2.esp
19  LIAT - Sounds.esp
1A  83Willows_101BUGS_V4_HighRes.esp
1B  Auto Unequip Ammo.esp
1C  Better Skill and Quest Books Names.esp
1D  Bring Out Your Dead.esp  [Version 1.2.3]
1E  dbmisc.esp
1F  Dead Body Collision.esp
20  Dual Sheath Redux.esp
21  EpisodeParallax.esp
22  fFastTravelSpeedMult_4.esp  [Version 1.0]
23  Immersive Patrols Merged All.esp
24  LIAT - NPCs.esp
25  More Salt Please.esp
26  More Salt Please - Dragonborn addon.esp
27  Moss Rocks.esp
28  Moss Rocks_DB.esp
29  ORM-Arvak.esp
2A  PilgrimsDelight.esp
2B  Quest Eraser_DG.esp
2C  SDO Full-LOD - Giant Campfires.esp
2D  SDO Full-LOD - The Morthal Swamp Complete.esp
2E  SDO Full-LOD - Whiterun Trundra Creeks.esp
2F  Skyrim Immersive Creatures.esp  [Version v6.5]
30  Skyrim Immersive Creatures - DLC2.esp  [Version v6.5]
31  Skyrim Flora Overhaul.esp
32  SkyrimImprovedPuddles-DG-HF-DB.esp  [Version 1.1]
33  Smelter_Riften & Solitude.esp
34  WetandCold.esp
35  WetandCold - Ashes.esp
36  NoxUE2.00.esp
37  RaceMenu.esp
38  RaceMenuPlugin.esp
39  SkyUI.esp
3A  Cloaks.esp
3B  Cloaks - Dawnguard.esp
3C  1nivWICCloaks.esp  [Version 2.3]
3D  1nivWICSkyCloaksPatch.esp  [Version 2.3]
3E  Elemental Staves.esp
3F  ExplosiveBoltsVisualized.esp
40  LeftHandRings.esp  [Version 1.4]
41  LeftHandRings - Dawnguard.esp  [Version 1.4]
42  TavernClothes-MTM.esp
43  Complete Crafting Overhaul_Remade.esp
44  aMidianBorn_ContentAddon.esp
45  CCO_SIC_Patch.esp
46  Run For Your Lives.esp  [Version 1.2.4]
47  dD - Realistic Ragdoll Force - Realistic.esp
48  Blacksmith Chests.esp
49  TheChoiceIsYours.esp
4A  TheChoiceIsYours_Dawnguard.esp
4B  TimingIsEverything.esp
4C  TimingIsEverything_RunForYourLives_Patch.esp
4D  Stealth Skills Rebalanced_COMPLETE.esp
4E  Soul Gems Differ - E.esp
4F  Guard Dialogue Overhaul.esp
50  SkyrimCoinReplacerRedux.esp
51  Requiem.esp
52  Requiem - Resources.esp
53  Requiem - HearthFires.esp
54  Requiem - Dragonborn.esp
55  Requiem - Hard Times.esp
56  Requiem - CCOR Patch.esp
57  Requiem - Bring Out Your Dead.esp
58  Requiem - SIC Patch.esp
59  Requiem - SIC Patch - DLC2.esp
5A  Requiem - Guard Dialogue Overhaul Patch.esp
5B  Requiem - Falskaar.esp
5C  Requiem - Wyrmstooth.esp
5D  Requiem - Immersive Patrols Merged All.esp
5E  Dice Game in Taverns.esp
5F  DSAMG - Greybeard Fix.esp
60  Gildergreen Regrown.esp  [Version 1.2.5]
61  Inconsequential NPCs.esp
62  moonpath_questdata.esp
63  Requiem - Moonpath Patch.esp
64  Shadowmarks for Player Homes.esp
65  SkyrimChimneysRW.esp
66  The Paarthurnax Dilemma.esp  [Version 1.2.6]
67  Appropriately Attired Jarls Redux.esp
68  BetterQuestObjectives.esp
69  BetterQuestObjectives-PaarDilemmaPatch.esp
6A  BetterQuestObjectives-RequiemPatch.esp
6B  BetterQuestObjectives-DBForevertoMisc.esp
6C  Book Covers Skyrim.esp
6D  TCIY-BCS Patch.esp
6E  REQ - BCS Patch.esp
6F  BCS - BSQBN Patch.esp
70  Civil War Repairs.esp
71  Civil War Overhaul.esp
72  Civil War Overhaul - Requiem Patch.esp
73  AOS_CWO Patch.esp
74  dD-No Twitching Dragon Death Animation.esp
75  Convenient Horses.esp
76  dD - Enhanced Blood Main.esp
77  dD-Dragonborn-Dawnguard-EBT Patch.esp
78  dD-DG-DB-Immersive Creatures EBT Patch.esp
79  Waterbreathing Breathless Emerge.esp
7A  aMidianborn_Skyforge_Weapons.esp
7B  Nausicaa's Tweaker.esp
7C  WhiterunAlivePiano.esp
7D  DawnofWindhelm.esp
7E  DawnofRiften.esp
7F  SoS - The Dungeons.esp  [Version 1.23]
80  ClimatesOfTamriel-Sound.esp
81  ClimatesOfTamriel-Dawnguard-Patch.esp
82  ClimatesOfTamriel-Dragonborn-Patch.esp
83  ClimatesOfTamriel-WinterEdition.esp
84  EnhancedLightsandFX.esp
85  ELFX - Exteriors.esp
86  ELFX - Dawnguard.esp
87  ELFX - Dragonborn.esp
88  CoT-WeatherPatch.esp
89  CoT-WeatherPatch_DB.esp
8A  Supreme Storms - Cot Version.esp
8B  CoT-WeatherPatch_SupStorms.esp
8C  ExpandedSnowSystems-CoT.esp
8D  CoT-WeatherPatch_ESS.esp
8E  Skylight-Torches.esp
8F  Skylight_DBWP.esp
90  Natural Lighting and Atmospherics.esp
91  Better Stealth AI for Followers.esp
92  DragonCombatOverhaulDragonborn.esp
93  DragonCombatOverhaul - Requiem Patch.esp
94  dD-No Spinning Death Animation.esp
95  Beards.esp
96  Brows.esp
97  3DNPC.esp
98  3DNPC - Requiem Patch.esp
99  Alternate Start - Live Another Life.esp  [Version 2.3.4]
9A  BetterQuestObjectives-AlternateStartPatch.esp
9B  SPTConsistentOlderPeople.esp  [Version 1.8]
9C  ethereal_elven_overhaul.esp
9D  Requiem - Ethereal Elven Overhaul.esp  [Version 1.2]
9E  SkyFalls + SkyMills + DG + DB.esp
9F  RealisticWaterTwo.esp
A0  RealisticWaterTwo - Waves.esp
A1  RealisticWaterTwo - Dawnguard.esp
A2  RealisticWaterTwo - Waves - Dawnguard.esp
A3  RealisticWaterTwo - Dragonborn.esp
A4  RealisticWaterTwo - Legendary.esp
A5  Bashed Patch, 0.esp
A6  Dual Sheath Redux Patch.esp

I could begin disabling suspect mods, but I thought that someone may have already figured this out before me.

[CJ2311]

Followers sometimes fail to attack as well.

 

I'm probably going to get butchered by krypto for saying this, but I did notice that in Gopher's LP, since he installed "Better Stealth AI for Followers", Kharjo started to sometimes ignore enemies until they hit him or the player, but then again, it could have been an incompatibility in his case.

 

As for the enemies though, I have to admit I have no clue whatsoever as what could cause that. I've had a similar mod list in the past (although with less requiem patches) and had no issues.

Maybe some of the Requiem patches aren't updated for the versions of the mods that you're using? Immersive Creatures for example was just updated a couple days ago, and the requiem patch might not be compatible yet.

Also, for the Immersive Patrols mod, seeing how the requiem patch does not have any ImmersivePatrols*.esp as a master, it makes me think that the patch is supposed to be a standalone, with the original esp disabled.

[z929669]

Good points about both of those (stealth and patrols). I'll give it a shot and post back after I get some play time.

 

I have been having this issue for awhile and am just now addressing here.

[z929669]

After fiddling for hours, it is 100% clear to me now that the issues lies with Requiem itself. Not Hard Times, not any of the Requiem patches. Requiem.esp itself. I basically have a complete STEP setup, and with Requiem disabled, sabre cats attack elk (and me), elk run from me, enemies always attack me and all in the world of Skyrim is as expected. With requiem enabled though, I get very strange behavior from all animals, and NPCs behave erradically, depending on the source. Vanilla NPC enemies will stand there and do nothing unless I try to talk with them (then they attack), while Interesting NPC enemies seem to attack.

 

If I enable Requiem, all vanilla creatures and NPCs begin behaving strangely again. I am wondering if there are bits of garbage in my save files that are causing this ... some kind of corruption with Requiem.

[DoubleYou]

Are you using higher ugrids? Maybe your game is spawning so many npcs that some of them have their ai disabled.

[torminater]

Try out a new save. If it only occurs on your "clean" requiem save, it's pretty sure the error comes from there.

[kryptopyr]

As DoubleYou said, there's a limit to how many creatures/NPCs can have AI. The following mod came out fairly recently, you might see if it helps: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/50823/?

If the problem is indeed too many NPCs, then even if the mod above fixes the standing-around issue, I would imagine there will be some impact on framerate caused by increasing the number of NPCs using AI at a given time. I have no idea how significant that impact will be, though.

 

I did notice that in Gopher's LP, since he installed "Better Stealth AI for Followers", Kharjo started to sometimes ignore enemies until they hit him or the player, but then again, it could have been an incompatibility in his case.

Was the Gopher's character sneaking when Kharjo was ignoring enemies? If so, then Kharjo's behavior pretty much defines exactly what Better Stealth AI is suppose to do.

[z929669]

The uGrids thing sounds plausible (I run uGrids 11), but then there is still the issue that my enemy AI --all else remaining the same-- is normal without Requiem.esp but AC (artificial catatonia) with Requiem.esp. I'll look at this though.

 

@torm

Testing a clean save is next thing on my list ... sure hope that is not it, because it takes time to get up to level 13 under hard-core Requiem, and I don't want to begin again!!

[CJ2311]

As DoubleYou said, there's a limit to how many creatures/NPCs can have AI. The following mod came out fairly recently, you might see if it helps: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/50823/?

If the problem is indeed too many NPCs, then even if the mod above fixes the standing-around issue, I would imagine there will be some impact on framerate caused by increasing the number of NPCs using AI at a given time. I have no idea how significant that impact will be, though.

 

I did notice that in Gopher's LP, since he installed "Better Stealth AI for Followers", Kharjo started to sometimes ignore enemies until they hit him or the player, but then again, it could have been an incompatibility in his case.

Was the Gopher's character sneaking when Kharjo was ignoring enemies? If so, then Kharjo's behavior pretty much defines exactly what Better Stealth AI is suppose to do.

Nope, sometimes it would happen when Gopher was not sneaking. But as I said, it's probably a mod conflict of sorts in his case, since I've not encountered that problem with the mod myself.

Also, we all know that Gopher doesn't RTFM :p

[kryptopyr]

As DoubleYou said, there's a limit to how many creatures/NPCs can have AI. The following mod came out fairly recently, you might see if it helps: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/50823/?

If the problem is indeed too many NPCs, then even if the mod above fixes the standing-around issue, I would imagine there will be some impact on framerate caused by increasing the number of NPCs using AI at a given time. I have no idea how significant that impact will be, though.

 

I did notice that in Gopher's LP, since he installed "Better Stealth AI for Followers", Kharjo started to sometimes ignore enemies until they hit him or the player, but then again, it could have been an incompatibility in his case.

Was the Gopher's character sneaking when Kharjo was ignoring enemies? If so, then Kharjo's behavior pretty much defines exactly what Better Stealth AI is suppose to do.

Nope, sometimes it would happen when Gopher was not sneaking. But as I said, it's probably a mod conflict of sorts in his case, since I've not encountered that problem with the mod myself.

Also, we all know that Gopher doesn't RTFM :p

Ah, okay.  Hard to say what the problem is/was.  I'm glad it's not a problem you've experienced (neither have I).  I stopped watching Gopher's Let Play when he got to Dragonborn.  I haven't had a chance to play through Dragonborn yet, and I didn't want to spoil it.

[z929669]

Eureka!

 

DoubleYou was correct. The high uGrids setting was effectively snuffing my Requiem-based AI. I assume that since that mod adds a lot of added AI with higher spawn rates, these scripts were taking a back seat to the vanilla AI and resulting in the inconsistent behaviors.

 

uGrids 11 is pretty ridiculous, so I trimmed to 5 to confirm and have gone up to 7, which also works. I will try 9 next to see if I can get away with that.

 

Thanks for the tip, marking this as solved for the next poor sap.