SKYRIMLE Skyrim Project Stability by GrandBulwark

[Deathwing514]

I do want to chime in and update my test on the software from my previous post.

 

Like I said it did work as intended, but there was a huge deal breaker for me when using the software that made me uninstall it right away.

 

During my 2 hour test run, I did notice that my game had microstutter every 5 minutes, which also caused my sound to break for a second.

 

I realized that cleanmem was responsible for these microstuter, as I set my timer to clean every 5 minutes.

 

So I do want to inform anyone that had this issue and didnt know where it was coming from.

[MontyMM]

It comes from Cleanmem pointlessly writing the contents of RAM to the pagefile, as it attempts to hide memory use.

[Aiyen]

Using bad settings in ENBoost, will produce a similar result actually. However there you can alter the values so the issue goes away, like I mentioned earlier.

[GrandBulwark]

To STEP team and everyone else,

I would sincerely like this topic to be dropped and removed.  It's aggravating to know that my work is linked to a controversy that can be solved by personal experimentation.  We came to the conclusion that cleanmem may be helping in some way that is NOT mentioned in it's description.  Even if that weren't the case, every bit of the testing done here is done on cleanmem, not on my guide collectively and the results are anecdotal.  I have a far greater amount of worthless anecdotal evidence, 450+ say my guide worked for them now.  I've supported numerous people who have followed your guides to their entirety and your guide still recommends a variety of potentially game breaking mods and questionable ini tweaks, whether you were aware of it or not.

 

In order to have founded, although anecdotal, evidence to support your claims against my guide (which is what this particular forum section is supposed to be about) people would have test the methods there entirely.  Rather than selecting one part to ridicule and ceaselessly debate about.  If it works for YOU, great.  Who cares what I think or what STEP thinks.  I believe Monty said something to the effect of, "Millions of people can't be wrong. Yes they can."

 

Whether it is by cleanmem or by the rest of the guide, people find my guide to be fully effective.  I hold that it's cleanmem and so do many others.  Regardless of what your personal opinion, I think that should be noted.  Given the recent errors in judgement on the part of STEP, not just with me but also with a few other mod authors I collaborate with; I would like to humbly request that this section be removed entirely along with anything referencing, citing, quoting, linking or otherwise mentioning my guide.  Cleanmem bashing is fine, but do it in your personal bash against ALL memory optimizers.  I will likewise remove the links from my guide to your projects.

 

It's a shame it has to come to that but you have your methods and I have mine.  I will not compromise on my principles and therefore I cannot in good faith recommend the use of the guides posted by STEP when it's members are clearly more interested in bashing my work and that of others.  I used to think you guys were more honorable than that, perhaps you are and you've made a mistake.  Or perhaps I'm wrong or over reacting.  In either of these situations, perhaps an alternative solution can be found.  Until then my decision stands, any users curious as to whether my guide works would be better off posting their questions/comments on my page rather than here.  I will support you, I will find your problem and I will tell you both sides of the controversy.  Here you will get STEP's view, my credibility may not be established here, but it's concrete on the nexus.  I have never failed to find a user's issue, 600+ comments in.  Never ONCE was the issue introduced or perpetuated by the use of cleanmem.  So wherein lies the "caution" in "Caution about memory optimizers" or at least those who employ the Trim API rather than stuffing.  "You should be cautious, this produt may make your computer do things that were in it's original design!" lol

 

To the STEP team proper,

please address these issues in private with me so a solution can be found.  Otherwise I will sever all ties with STEP and discourage users from adhering to your advice/guides; much like you have been doing to my guide since your FOUNDER offered me a position here and then you shot me down.  I apologize if I have been in any way disrespectful to STEP or it's members, I'm extremely angry about the treatment I've received here.  I've tried reasoning with you and I've tried leaving only to come back and see that users are being mislead by outlandish claims that cleanmem presents some security risk, or worse that I am some kind of advocate or employee of the company that makes cleanmem.  When did rigorous analysis change to unfounded paranoia?  Furthermore, when did STEP stop being respectful to mod/guide authors?  I was under the impression that even if our methods differ, we were trying to achieve the same goal. 

[MontyMM]

To repeat myself, I said:

• Cleanmem doesn't do what it claims and creates misleading memory readings.

• ENBboost is genuine and does work.

• This guide contains several recommendations that I do not agree with, and could cause you significant problems.

I stand by all of those statements, which in are line with what I said in the original discussion.  I really don't see this as "jumping aboard the hate boat", nor do I see much in the way of hate speech preceding it. There is nothing aggressive or "dishonourable" about criticizing technical solutions, and offering clear arguments against them.  I do not personally recommend your guide, and some elements of it could certainly cause problems.  I only noticed some of these after the original discussion, which gave me reason to mention this when the thread was raised again.

 

STEP is founded upon open and critical discussion, which does occasionally upset those whose work is criticized.  But STEP simply couldn't function any other way, which I think is self-evident.  

 

If you feel the need to remove links to STEP from your guide, we will probably have to live with that as the price of our speech.

[GrandBulwark]

You are obviously the last person I want to discuss this with Monty but since you've started. Okay let me clarify a few things.

 

To repeat myself I said,

• Cleanmem is not dangerous therefore the "Caution" which you dictate is necessary is needless.
• Whether or not Cleanmem works as described is irrelevant. We both have anecdotal evidence proving our points.
• The hate speech carries over from many other posts from your other memory optimization thread and you certainly weren't kind.
• I never once referenced ENboost
• I'm not asking you to censor yourself, I'm asking you to use tact rather than just blatantly disregarding the amount of effort I've put into my guide as a whole.
• Step also recommend a variety of game breaking mods that are PROVEN to be dangerous.
• Step also contains several recommendations that I do not agree with, yet I don't turn pages devoted to your work into a ceaseless bashing a particular part.
• Whether or not disrespect was intended, it was received
• There is a difference between critical discussion and blowing smoke because you disagree
• My reading comprehension is wonderful, there is no need to repeat yourself or to outline your concerns, I'm aware of them.
• All guides bear some degree of danger, nothing in mine will cause you harm if you follow directions. Anything that could be potentially dangerous is clearly stated in Yellow and underlined text!!

Furthermore, if you are going to be condescending at least be direct about it. This is not about Cleanmem, it's about my guide as a whole. It's not my work you are criticizing, but rather that of cleanmem's creator. Maybe you should make a thread for cleanmem individually or perhaps you could stick to the one you started about memory optimizers. Anything is better than associating an entire guide with garbage because you "Don't agree with it." The arguments I see here are as unfounded as those you see on the nexus, "cleanmem doesn't work!" Oh my god maybe that's because you DIDN'T follow the guide. Maybe it's the guide that works! Maybe there is a reason cleanmem is at the bottom of the guide, maybe there is a reason for the setup guide for it. I mean it would seem logical to FOLLOW the guide you're bashing, before bashing it. Furthermore it seems quite illogical to bash a guide on the basis of a single program that the testers tested directly rather than as a part of the guide. The only person who did follow it, Deathwing514 says that is does work with a minor skip at the apportioned cleanup interval which is a known issue and is mentioned in the guide. So where does the negative review come from? Cleanmem, not my guide but cleanmem. Meaning that this entire thread defaming my guide is a misplaced entirely. The other issues you have with it? I'm not biting on that one lest we start another ridiculous argument and further inflame something I would rather let die. I will await Z and Farlo's reply. Perhaps they can help to resolve this issue, if not then oh well.

 

I sense some hypocrisy here. When starac pointed out that the author's of serious HD and 2K textures were just overlayed and upscaled, you were the first to point out how wrong that was despite that fact that from an objective standpoint he was correct. I hate using that example because Starac was kind of a ass in that thread, however the fact remains that you were offended for Nebula, despite the fact that Starac stated an easily verifiable fact. Want proof that it's a fact? Ask Cabal120 or insanitysorrow or any reputable texture creator that uses custom ground models for that matter. Reference quote

I don't quite agree on this Z, but I'll do as you ask if you consider this beneficial to the project. Should Nebula ever join the discussion here, I just wanted to put on record that I wasn't comfortable with certain comments, and not impressed by fallacious arguments from authority. I'll stay off this frequency now.

Your parting words. Link to thread, pages 3-5 5 being your final comment.

---

Oh and Deathwing514, the audio skip is caused by one of two things; realtek running in the background which can be easily replaced by a generic HD sound driver from windows, or you have audio enhancements which can be easily disabled through windows sound. At least this is what fixed it in my case, thus making it anecdotal. however, I'm curious as to whether or not this would solve that particular problem on your setup.

[MontyMM]

I really don't know why you're dredging up debates I had years ago as relevant to this discussion. In any case, I'm not engaging in hypocrisy with respect to the argument you reference.  An "Argument from Authority" does not mean any argument from a person who happens to be in a position of authority (and being a forum admin hardly gives me delusions of being that!  :P )  It is a specific form of fallacious argument that says, "I am a great authority on this, for whatever reason, therefore my argument is more valid".  That is fallacious because simply asserting your own estimation of how right your argument is likely to be is not logically very convincing!  That is what Starac was doing, and what I was taking issue with.  I do not believe I have ever made any argument that relies on appeals to my own authority, against you or anyone else on here - I simply give my opinions and try to back them up with evidence and argument.

 

As to the rest of it, well I too have no interest in going through it all with a fine-tooth comb, and I am quite content to just offer my advice and let everyone make their own minds.

 

I can say though, that while anyone using an advanced mod guide like STEP obviously takes the risk of messing up their Skyrim game, there are suggestions in your guide that could cause the significant problems to a user's entire Windows setup, and I consider them an unjustified and unwarranted risk.

[GrandBulwark]

It wasn't "argument from authority" that prompted my reference to your post, rather what you took issue with which was a perceived insult on Nebula; which I understand. He was rather insensitive and, as I previously stated, an ass. But being and insensitive ass doesn't necessary make your points illogical. Although I strongly agree with your defense of nebula's character in that situation, in the interest of full disclosure you should have mentioned that he was correct in his assessment of the textures themselves. In this case, and in the case of my mod you position of authority works against you, whether you consider yourself an authoritative figure or not. By alleging that a mod is potentially unsafe you are swaying others due to your involvement with STEP. I agree you should be able to voice your opinion granted, and I'm sorry that you feel that way. It is made very clear that you MUST read the descriptions of each step prior to using each step. I worked EXTREMELY hard making the entire page as idiot proof as possible. No offense to anyone, I just don't want to answer repetitious questions when I can simply post more information to answer potential question. The guide has evolved a great deal since the last time you visited it.

 

There is also a difference between offering advice, and condemning a guide because you feel as though it is unsafe. Again condemnation may not be your intention, however it is people's perception that matters. EG If I type like THIS ALL THE TIME I WOULD BE PERCEIVED AS AN INTELLIGENT APE!!! I assure you I am not an ape! lol Having a glass of water poured over your computer is dangerous, but I don't see you condemning hydration! It is for users to decide to warranted and unwarranted. You opinion on their safety is irrelevant, their safety is assure considering you follow directions. Their safety is also thoroughly addressed at each juncture making users aware how problematic mistakes can be, and how advanced the STEP itself is.

 

Many things are dangerous in this world Monty, that doesn't make them inherently evil, or unworthy of investigation. My whole issue here is that you vendetta against cleanmem has turned into defamation of my guide as a whole. What you consider to be unsafe, should not be addressed as if it is a guaranteed mishap. Most users will follow directions if they feel the need to follow a guide. Those that DON'T follow instructions cannot be helped by you or me. If my instructions are followed, the guide is safe.

[MontyMM]

Let's just hold our horses for a second here - I'm getting a bit weary of you acting like the aggrieved party. In all of our disagreements, I have not attacked you personally, only your arguments and recommendations. That, I think, is fairly reasonable and proper behaviour on a technical forum that specifically encourages rigorous debate. I did not accuse you of being lazy, or dishonest, or anything else of that sort. You however, have accused me of hate speech, hypocrisy, and waging a personal vendetta, and that's just on this page!

 

My admin position on this forum neither works for or against me - it is irrelevant in these types of conversation, and I treat it as such. The rest of it, about intelligent apes, glasses of water, and the inherent evil of things, I do not feel properly qualified to address.

 

My opinion on the problems in your guide is as relevant or irrelevant as people choose to make it. If you consider it irrelevant, perhaps you could safely ignore it, and stop using this forum to accuse me of various crimes?

[Aiyen]

Okay just to chip in with stuff releveant to the guide as a whole first.

 

Just a few days ago we had an incident with a person who had used your guide in its entirety using his mod list, and he had problems with just about all.

The advice was to restore vanilla .ini´s and remove cleanmen. And then the game worked better. Granted that he might not have done everything 100% as your guide states, but that is a common issue for STEP as well. Not everybody is tech savy or have a general understanding of the concepts the first time around. But as along as people learn then its good!

 

When people come here and say they followed your guide, then obviously this post is the first place to come since that is what get when you use the search function. Just like people reference other tweak guides around the web. In all cases then we would like to be able to provide support as needed. To this extent then a place like this will always be created. And if that support means saying "try to not use all of this stuff" and it then works for people then it is not because your guide is bad, or just because they might not have followed it 100%. The game engine is old and meh, and there are mod list differences and system differences. But it is has nothing to do with trying to discredit your work, or anything similar!

You have found settings that work for your install and you try to share it! But other peoples setups are different, and they might not work for them! Telling them that they should try to undo your work, is not the same as saying your work is bad!

 

Further stuff about your guide and criticism of others work:

Your very own guide have extensive areas of "blacklisting" other mods, and you also say that people should not trust save game cleaners. Is this not doing the exact same as some people here are doing about cleanmem ? You say that people should not use enhanced blood textures! The mod works perfectly as it should on smaller mod lists! Is the mod then automatically worth condemnation ? It seems a bit hypocritical of you to say we should remove reference to your guide, because we do not like one aspect, when your very own guide is doing the same to others.

 

In general about ini tweaks:

Based on reports from people over the last few months, then the general consensus among the support staff, and guests in general is that, less ini tweaks are better. Even over at the ENB forums this is starting to sink in. People have been using many weird memory, and threaded tweaks for so long, that most do not even remember where they got them from. And in just about all cases, those specific tweaks does absolutely nothing for the game. (Which has been proven by Boris over at the ENB forums during his creation of his ENBoost).

So far based on how people report ini tweak issues, then I advice after the a golden rule! Less tweaks are better!

 

In general about memclean:

Its a 3rd party software that claims to do good things for your entire machine. However when oh so many technically competent people out there say that this sort of stuff is placebo effect half the time and smoke and mirrors the other then one should listen to them! If not then just the simple logical idea. If someone made something that was more effective then MS for the ENTIRE system (not just skyrim) .... do you not think that MS would buy that thing and implement it ASAP? Also what happens to other games and programs ? Can you say it will work safely for ALL application ? No you cannot, since your guide is about skyrim only! So even if it somehow seems to do something to the skyrim process, then it might not do it for everything else, and by that argument alone one should not touch it. At least that is my opinion about it. Even ATTK which is more or less the same thing, but it only affected the skyrim process! So even it was "better".

 

Instead of continuing to advocate this software, why do you not go over to ENBoost, which is proven to work, and which only work for Skyrim. It would make more sense, since its a guide on how to make Skyrim stable after all. That would make more sense in my mind at least.

 

Phew that was a long one.

To finish off. I personally have great respect for the work you have made with your guide, and I have used a few tips from it and said to others they should try it out themselves. But please do not keep up with this "We bash your entire guide" thing because it is not true, we simply do the same as you do when you advice caution against certain other tweaks, and mods!

[GrandBulwark]

It wasn't "argument from authority" that prompted my reference to your post, rather what you took issue with which was a perceived insult on Nebula; which I understand. He was rather insensitive and, as I previously stated, an ass. But being and insensitive ass doesn't necessary make your points illogical.

Let me clarify this. I agree with your defense of Nebula as a person, the fat and lazy points Starac made were not the point I referenced or mentioned. I never said you called me fat or lazy, I said you condemned my guide on the basis of misinformation and paranoia. I referenced that to demonstrate that although you are quick to condemn things you disagree with, you are also quick to overlook perfectly valid facts contained within such information. An example being Starac's perfectly legitimate assessment of the textures (Not of Nebula). Also you are willing to overlook the perfectly valid tips in my guide because of alleged safety issues. Safety issues which have not hurt anyone thus far, and anyone it does hurt someone then they didn't follow directions. Everyone should read the description before jumping off and saying, "You ruined my game/system." No I didn't, you did by not following instructions.

 

I'm sorry man, we left on good terms last time it appears we may not this time. You certainly weren't worried about qualifications when you condemned my guide for unsubstantiated claims. Are You operating under the impression that everyone is an idiot? Safety issues are everywhere, cleanmem is safe and reading the directions is easy so WHERE is the risk of which you speak? Why have there been NO complaints? Why are there so many endorsements? Why am I supporting people who follow YOUR guides? Why do I have a staggering 100% success rate with Skyrim Troubleshooting? Why did you founder endorse the very guide you are condemning?

 

I'm sorry if I'm making you weary but I'm sick of having my work dragged through the mud because you disagree with it's practicality or question it's safety. You've never once directly contacted me to say, "Hey, this could be potentially unsafe GB. You should revise or remove it because of X." Never once have you said a kind word about anything in the guide. You wonder why I accuse you of being hateful? Because everything you say in reference to my guide is NEGATIVE; hate may have been a strong word. The reason I accused you of having a personal vendetta is you post that is in and of itself a vendetta against the use of memory optimizers. The reason I'm acting like an aggrieved is because I'm aggrieved, or perhaps more specifically angry at the way this thread has turned.

 

You could also safely ignore this thread but given the fact that our last fiasco lasted a few day it seems like, you should know we're both too stubborn to just roll over or concede to anything the other has to say. I apologize for the Hypocrite comment. It was said in anger, and while I still stand that there were hypocritical undertones when compared to this situation; it was likely just because you omitted that he was correct about the textures themselves.(NOT about the laziness or fatness of their creator.) It wasn't what you did say, rather what you didn't say that struck me a hypocritical. Again, I'm sorry for that; I'm not in the habit of insulting people but I was very angry. (TBH I would have just told him to get lost, so I suppose your patience is superior to mine in that respect.)

[GrandBulwark]

Oh and to quote Z;

 

No problem. There is a civil and valid dialogue that you (others?) and Starac are engaged in, so I do not wish to impose myself in any manner other than to ask that it be continued in the "General Discussion" > "Non-STEP Related" forum wherever/whenever it detracts from the topic of SRO explicitly ... just in case this draws a bigger audience.

Z had consideration for the reputation of Starac, ass though he may have been. He cared about the defamation of the mod and the author. The entire line of recent posts here are not directly related to my guide. Other than by cleanmem which likely wasn't configured as direct in my guide.

[GrandBulwark]

Okay just to chip in with stuff releveant to the guide as a whole first.

 

Just a few days ago we had an incident with a person who had used your guide in its entirety using his mod list, and he had problems with just about all.

The advice was to restore vanilla .ini´s and remove cleanmen. And then the game worked better. Granted that he might not have done everything 100% as your guide states, but that is a common issue for STEP as well. Not everybody is tech savy or have a general understanding of the concepts the first time around. But as along as people learn then its good!

 

When people come here and say they followed your guide, then obviously this post is the first place to come since that is what get when you use the search function. Just like people reference other tweak guides around the web. In all cases then we would like to be able to provide support as needed. To this extent then a place like this will always be created. And if that support means saying "try to not use all of this stuff" and it then works for people then it is not because your guide is bad, or just because they might not have followed it 100%. The game engine is old and meh, and there are mod list differences and system differences. But it is has nothing to do with trying to discredit your work, or anything similar!

You have found settings that work for your install and you try to share it! But other peoples setups are different, and they might not work for them! Telling them that they should try to undo your work, is not the same as saying your work is bad

 

Further stuff about your guide and criticism of others work:

Your very own guide have extensive areas of "blacklisting" other mods, and you also say that people should not trust save game cleaners. Is this not doing the exact same as some people here are doing about cleanmem ? You say that people should not use enhanced blood textures! The mod works perfectly as it should on smaller mod lists! Is the mod then automatically worth condemnation ? It seems a bit hypocritical of you to say we should remove reference to your guide, because we do not like one aspect, when your very own guide is doing the same to others.

 

In general about ini tweaks:

Based on reports from people over the last few months, then the general consensus among the support staff, and guests in general is that, less ini tweaks are better. Even over at the ENB forums this is starting to sink in. People have been using many weird memory, and threaded tweaks for so long, that most do not even remember where they got them from. And in just about all cases, those specific tweaks does absolutely nothing for the game. (Which has been proven by Boris over at the ENB forums during his creation of his ENBoost).

So far based on how people report ini tweak issues, then I advice after the a golden rule! Less tweaks are better!

 

In general about memclean:

Its a 3rd party software that claims to do good things for your entire machine. However when oh so many technically competent people out there say that this sort of stuff is placebo effect half the time and smoke and mirrors the other then one should listen to them! If not then just the simple logical idea. If someone made something that was more effective then MS for the ENTIRE system (not just skyrim) .... do you not think that MS would buy that thing and implement it ASAP? Also what happens to other games and programs ? Can you say it will work safely for ALL application ? No you cannot, since your guide is about skyrim only! So even if it somehow seems to do something to the skyrim process, then it might not do it for everything else, and by that argument alone one should not touch it. At least that is my opinion about it. Even ATTK which is more or less the same thing, but it only affected the skyrim process! So even it was "better".

 

Instead of continuing to advocate this software, why do you not go over to ENBoost, which is proven to work, and which only work for Skyrim. It would make more sense, since its a guide on how to make Skyrim stable after all. That would make more sense in my mind at least.

 

Phew that was a long one.

To finish off. I personally have great respect for the work you have made with your guide, and I have used a few tips from it and said to others they should try it out themselves. But please do not keep up with this "We bash your entire guide" thing because it is not true, we simply do the same as you do when you advice caution against certain other tweaks, and mods!

What is hypocritical is the way the ENTIRE guide is condemned for the sake of one program.  The mods that are Blacklisted are completely founded and they are NOT bashed.  Please read the section more thoroughly.  Technically it's you load order that causes the issue in most cases, rather than any particular mod; which is MENTIONED right there.  Although there are a few mods there that are COMPLETELY broken and numerous people can verify that.  Claralux and Warzones for instance.  I have no issue making a valid statement as to the functionality of a mod; but to condemn a multi part guide for the sake of unsubstantiated safety concerns is NOT constructive.

 

Cleanmem works fine for me and thousands of others.  Technically competent people are not infallible and ENboost does not replace the need for cleanmem.  Who has PROVEN the ENboost works?  STEP?  I'm sorry but my faith in step is a bit shaken since this fiasco, the last one and the one pertaining to GDO.  Who cares if it does for that matter?  Cleanmem has been fixing the same issues with less configuration time.  It doesn't work for you?  You didn't do it right.  Your friend could have come back to me for help.  There are no ini tweaks posted, I am also of the opinion that less tweaks are better and even when there were ini tweaks, they were optional.  Also cleanmem has an only list so it can run on a particular process rather than all of them, so that's out the window.

 

Basically cleanmem stays because why fix something that isn't broken.  And while you guys are fumbling about updating ENboost twice a day, my memory fix is implanted and in it's final version.  Perhaps I was bit offended; and I still am.  This entire debate could have been placed elsewhere in a more reasonable location like caution against memory optimizers for instance.  As you've so kindly pointed out; there is more than cleanmem in the guide.  I would appreciate if any debates as to the functionality of cleanmem be placed elsewhere and everyone just agrees to disagree.  STEP's opinion on cleanmem is posted with it's link in my guide; which is more than I can say about my opinion.  Despite NO concrete evidence of it's ineffectiveness, cleanmem is bashed constantly and the rest of the guide is overlooked.

 

EDIT: My guide is not simply about Skyrim, and yes I can in fact say that cleanmem would be safe for use with all applications because ALL it does is utilize the trim API that is included with windows. So by all right Microsoft CREATED the very tool that actually does the works, so what should they purchase? I have many theories as to why this helps skyrim; but I'll save the speculation as they will just be shot down anyway. The point is that it does help. Although I disagree with a great number of things posted, I appreciate that you at least looked at a recent version of my guide and actually had something to contribute other than. "Cleanmem doesn't work!" Tell that to the 263 hours on my current save, with no crashes and 27 gigs of HD textures.

[GrandBulwark]

Cleanmem does nothing useful that I can see' date=' did nothing for fps or stutters that was measurable and [u']definitely did not [/u]help with CTDs, freezes or infinite load screens, just uses up some CPU cycles. Probably doesn't do any harm though, its not like Skyrim uses up all your CPU cores' cycles anyway. (at least with ATTK, it did make Skyrim load a little quicker.)

 

As for the "blacklist" of mods, I too have mods that I recommend people to keep out of their load-order if they are experiencing problems but to actually "blacklist" these mods is a bit unfair. As for most people that isn't modding their game like a nut, mods like EBT and Wet & Cold, even with their ongoing scripts shouldn't cause too much of an issue. Gopher's let's play series is living proof that Wet & Cold is fine if your load list isn't too much. And if you're going to "blacklist" mods, then this is a very incomplete list of mods with running scripts.

 

The guide also recommended various dubious ini settings that either don't do anything in Skyrim or can cause problems in some situations, like the threaded settings do nothing measurable and could potentially cause lock ups. (This section really made me suspicious of the rest of the guide and its credibility the first time I encountered this project)

 

I also recommend for most people to turn papyrus logging off unless you are actually having a problem and be reminded to turn it OFF once you've finished checking.

 

As for window services, most are harmless and take up insignificant resources when idle. So unless you have a very old system (which I did), even then I didn't observe any improvements in stability at all nor fps increases.

 

It just seems that the guide is a collection of "fixes" that the author has found on the internet and have tried and seemed to have helped him in his quest for stability. I think at least a part of the guide doesn't have a solid scientific foundation, has inadequate testing and contains nothing innovative.

 

And any guide about stability that doesn't mention the 3Gb 32bit limits and strongly recommend ENBoost and doesn't give advice about texture size (as a source of instability) is incomplete at best and outdated at worst.

 

(Before anyone jumps down my throat and eat me from the inside out (especially the author of the forementioned project ;) ): This is just my subjective opinion which I am entitled to, like you're entitled to yours, and I probably have as much end-user experience as anyone on this forum in our search for Skyrim Stability.)

Completely incorrect.  The blacklist is thoroughly explained, read more carefully.  The ini tweaks are gone and they were an optional addition, which CLEARLY stated that they were experimental and not verified.  However the tweaks caused an adverse reaction to MODS, not stability.  Mod's like Falskaar didn't like the backgroundloadlip parameter.  The multithreaded tweaks have never been conclusively attributed to lock up.  I still use some of them and I've used all of them for hundreds of hours without issue, then again I don't use Falskaar.

 

Doesn't mention the 32 bit limits?  Do you need glasses? That has been in my guide since before STEP ever had an interest in it!  Almost immediately after creation that was addressed.  Texture optimization is easily avoided by simply downloading smaller textures.  Why would you want to waste the bandwidth?  Use properly compressed textures within your systems specs. Problem solved without any hassle or excessive wait times.  Texture optimization breaks certain textures entirely.  Not to mention the mantra of the project is stability at no graphical cut.  Texture optimization can decrease graphic fidelity in many cases.  

 

Windows service?  Seems lazy not not disable useless things at least to me.  Why lock down the resources you have, this contradicts the pursuit of stability in general.  It may not have a huge impact, but it certainly cannot hurt.

 

Hahahaha, STEP is in and of itself knowledge primarily gained from the internet and compiled.  Just like mine so your argument that my guide is a "collection of fixes found via the internet" is also applicable here.  The argument that it is incomplete or outdated, by who's standard?  yours?  It's NOT complete a bit more is added everyday.  But the omission of texture optimizers is a choice; and I do advocate the use of ENboost, I just don't support issues with it.  That is also mentioned in numerous places.  

 

To properly assess the scientific foundation of anything, you have to approach it from an objective, unbiased and thorough manner.  Given the misinformation posted, I'm guessing that you had no intention of giving my guide a fair chance; rather your intention was to skim through in search of errors.  There are none to be found AFAIK and the ones you reference would have been better taken in CONTEXT!  And before you jump down my throat and eat me from the inside out, know that many others are in line to do so!  Also know I had jalapeno peppers for lunch so it may be a spicy trip! :) 

[MontyMM]

My repudiation of memory optimizers was because grand claims were made about solving Skyrim's memory problems, which were perhaps the most pressing question for STEP at that time. To characterize a serious investigation into the truth about this matter as a 'vendetta' does not make much sense.

 

STEP is in the business of analyzing and criticizing things, and then recommending or not recommending them. That's all. You have praised us in this work, and were very keen to join the team. We do our best to dig down to the facts in an impartial way.

 

When you find your own work being criticized, and on the wrong side of the argument and the evidence, suddenly we become a wretched conspiracy.

 

You will find that I support the work of Boris, of Altimor, and that I try to leave encouraging comments for the many projects I follow. Why would I single you out for persecution? I haven't. I simply do not believe the advice in your guide is good. I believe that your claims are too grand, and that the BIOS changes, "memory optimization", registry "cleaning", and other tweaks you propose are simply a bad idea. That's all I'm saying.

 

You continue to insinuate various ad hominem arguments against me and STEP in general.

I do not think you are helping your case with your current line of over-reaching and slightly hysterical arguments.