cstarkey42

What speedfix is everyone using? Like I said, I always just found it easier to disable Disparity's and leave Better Vampire's fix on but I just started a new test using Disparity's instead. I also dropped the combat mods (ie no Duel or Deadly Combat, only running with Combat Evolved, Vigor, and Weapon and armor attributes) and I didn't have the speed problem at all. I watched getav weaponspeedmult for a lot of enemy npcs as well as going through the effects via mfg and everything seems to be working now. The weapon speed, movement speed and attack speed all seem to fluctuate depending on race, how active in combat they were (fatigue), and if they'd not swung their weapon for a few moments during battle after previously attacking. This all seemed to be consistent with how Disparity, Vigor and WAA intend them to behave. Also, dropping the "normal" combat mods seemed to keep my block1 from exploding like it always seems to do. Action combat is supposed to get an update soon from a new author who took it over and supposedly is optimizing the scripting process so I might give that a try when it's up. Ensai hinted he might try a combat mod as well, avoiding the scripting issues that people are claiming DC and Duel have. I'd like to try Ultimate Combat again but I'm not sure what the issues are with that mod and FNIS so I think I'm just going to stay away from the big three until something better comes along. Combat Evolved really seems to make a difference, however, and all of the fights seemed to involve npcs that were much more aware of what was happening. Of course, fighting with TGM on could skew my results a little bit.

Yeah, I've been using Mfg to try and figure it out but it's still tough. Between Vigor and Disparity affecting stamina and speed it's tough to sort out. I like that so many mods are offering fixes to the speed bug but since multiple fixes cancel each other out and seem to cause new issues I sort of wish they wouldn't, especially some, like Better Vampires, where it seems out of place and you only stumble onto it if you're paying close attention to all the options in the mcm. Sometimes Vigor seems like the culprit, intentionally causing them to be slow when they're wore out, but other times it seems too extreme and too early in the fight to be attributable to that. I really like Vigor but I wasn't planning on dealing with this new issue when I started to test for a new play through so I'm starting to lose patience with it.

It seems that it's actually Vigor that is making the change and it is intended, as near as I can tell. Weapon speed and movement attack speed go down as stamina goes down so fighting an npc who swings like crazy will wear them out very quickly, to the point that they seem to be attacking in super slow motion. I'm using Deadly Combat, which seems to make npcs more hostile, vs duel which makes them more calculating, so that could be compounding the issue. Deadly combat and vigor also increase stamina regeneration, so if you get away from the npc for just a second they recover. Since I'm level one and fighting weak npcs that could compound the issue also as npcs have less stamina to rely on.

Thanks for reminding me, darkside, I have a problem when pulling the bow as well. When I'm aiming at someone and I pull the bow the game basically freezes until I let go of the mouse button. The bow is never fully drawn, however, so the arrow barely flies anywhere. If I'm not aiming at anyone then it works fine and the bug doesn't seem to occur for every enemy npc. I know the last time it happened I was aiming at a skeleton. This is another new problem and one I keep forgetting about since I don't start my test games with a bow and only encounter it if I happen to pick one up during my trial run.

I haven't but I'm looking again to see if I missed it. I did add some of the movement changes of vigor that deal with adding limits to turning while attacking, so maybe the problem lies in there?

I've been getting the super, super, like insanely super slow motion enemy attacks as well since adding WAA and Vigor. I didn't have the WAA speed fix installed and use both Better Vampires and Disparity, both of which offer the fix. I usually would disable Disparity's fix, since I'm in that mcm and not messing with BV as much, but I tried adding the WAA fix and disabling both BV and Disparity's fix and it still occured. This was in an existing test game, however, so I'm not sure if the scripts needed time to fire ( or maybe there's a new option in the WAA mcm, I guess I didn't check ). As far as I know, only Disparity and BV are the only other mods trying to fix the weapon speed. It's different than the bug was before, whereas it used to be your weapon speeds that were messed up and now it's the npcs that are stuck in slow motion when they attack, going back to normal speed when not attacking. It doesn't seem to be every enemy npc, though once it starts it seems to affect more and more of them.

LOOT is much more complex than I would have guessed, it seems. T5E takes so much longer to load than LOOT does at any point during the process so it still seems crazy to me to think that it's going through every esp as quickly as it does. The problem, however, is still that, even when it does find a conflict, it doesn't seem that it can always know which esp should prevail. Between Vividian ENB and Vividian Extended Weathers all it would know is that they edit the same edits. I don't know under what conditions it would "decide" which fog distance, color edits, etc... should prevail. The same problem would occur for mods such as Bijin Warmaidens and ESF Companions. They both edit Aela but how is LOOT to know which should prevail, the edit to the stats and armor or the edits to her appearance? It would seem you'd still want to micromanage in both cases. Still thanks for the info, GrantSP. It is good to know LOOT has more under the hood than a masterlist and looking for master dependencies. The people who make these applications for us to use are crazy smart.

@Mator Thanks for the explanation. I'm sure I was doing it wrong and probably have been since way before the standalone came out. I think the problem in my thinking was that I thought that the standalone was grabbing the textures and scripts after MO had loaded them into memory since the esp refers to a file name and didn't seem path dependent. It never occurred to me that the esp needed to be in the original folder in order for it to work correctly. The old script still built my translation file and facegen files fine so maybe it didn't always work like this, I don't know. Thanks for clearing it up for me now though, I've adjusted how I set up creating my merges and everything seems to be working fine now.

Placing expanded weathers before the other vividian weather plugins, in this case the Vividian ENB merge, overrides practically, if not completely, all of the edits expanded weathers makes. Again, unless I'm way off base here, LOOT is not doing any sort of analysis concerning the internals of your plugins, though it would be awesome if it did. It'd take a lot longer, but this would be a killer feature to be added to T5E. Until then you simply must micromanage your LOs. As far as I know the closest it gets to doing that is by loading dependent plugins after their masters. In that regards it is more helpful and autonomous than BOSS was. Skynet, however, it is not.

I guess when you think about it it does make sense and isn't even really LOOT's fault. The two esps in question are custom made, custom named (following your guide) so LOOT couldn't know which is first since the expanded weather plugin doesn't have any dependency on the Vividian ENB plugin. Going from an earlier comment, I think too many people think LOOT does some sort of T5E analysis of what the plugin does and bases it's construction on any conflicts it finds. Since that is not the case and it's just using a predefined masterlist and user defined meta-data, it really would have no way to know what order those, or any other custom made/named plugins should be placed in. In fact, it doesn't even "know" that they are weather related mods so any order it puts them in, relative to themselves and even every other mod in the load order, is purely random. I've noticed the more mods I add the more likely it is that LOOT just shrugs its shoulders and puts them at the end of the list, whether I think they should go in that "section" of my LO or not.

Thanks. Rereading the description from the standalone page makes me want to keep using it so I guess I'll have to compromise. I've already made separate profiles for a few of the merges, avoiding have too many active mods and a longer standalone initial load, so I think I'll just move the folders in those profiles to the top of the list which should at least save me the time of having to run searches for each mod. It just becomes a matter of how quickly can I click through a list of folders. Hopefully I'll figure out a few tricks with the remerge option in order to save me some hassle in the future. While I have your ear, Neo, I'm not sure if I missed a step but LOOT was placing Vividian ENB after the Vividian Expanded Weathers plugin, which seems to defeat the purpose of have the expanded weather plugins. I added a rule to change the order, but then I just merged them all into one Vividian ENB plugin instead and saved an esp. I was also curious if you were considering adding Art of the Catch. It seems like a good mod but I haven't played with it too much and wasn't sure if you had and what your thoughts are on it. Thanks.

It has some advantages, especially for smaller merges of just patches, but it's the big 15-20 esp merges that are frustrating, especially when it's composed of multi-mod esps, such that activating and deactivating the esps requires finding each folder if the esp is left in the original folder. Do you think I'd be fine if I just used the scripts for my larger, non-standard merges and used the standalone for patches and more manageable merges? Or are there other advantages/bugfixes/etc... with the standalone that I'm not aware of or am overlooking?

@darkside (and anyone else who'd care to chime in) Well, that didn't work for me either but I think I know why. At the end of building the merge I realized I should scroll up through the output display (I know, right, sometimes I feel like I've been using a pc for like 2 days of my life! ) and I find that it's only looking for the assets in the folder where the esp is located. I've always made it a practice to create a new folder, copy all the esps that I am merging over to it, and hide them in the original folder. Then, when I need to redo a merge I can simply select that folder, run T5E (now the merge program) and then deselect the folder. It's saved me countless hours. Am I really to understand that everyone is going to each individual folder, double clicking it, selecting the tab, moving the esp, rinse and repeat, and then doing it all in reverse? Every single time? That's pure insanity to me. Can someone please tell me what this program has over the merge script? I thought I liked the program but it's got too many drawbacks compared to running it in T5E, at least as far as it stands now. I know it was needed to get ICAO to merge correctly but, now that that's being left as is, is there any other major advantage I might miss out on if I use the scripts instead? Thanks.

Thanks for the suggestions, those look like an interesting set of mods. Now that frostfall is out I've been setting up for a new game and I might have to give those a try. It sounds like they work well with duel or deadly combat as well, and, judging from the descriptions, they sound like they'd work better as compliments to one of those two mods rather than replacements for them. Have you tried them with and without a major combat mod? Thanks again.

@darkside Thanks again, I'll start doing that from now on. Hopefully this gets fixed soon as I find the need to redo a handful of merges frequently, whether it's because of an update to the mod or patches or because I'm just trying to slip yet another esp into the mix. I like the merge program but I miss the flexibility that doing it in Tes5Edit provided, both in terms of simply deleting the old merge and instantly starting from scratch and also the ability to edit the merge before saving, with all the merged esps and the final product all lined up nice and neat.

Thanks. Can you define "start fresh" for me? That's what I'd prefer to do as well but I delete the contents of the output folder, go to the merge tab and delete the previous merge, and all of the individual esps lose the association they previously had on the opening screen. I just tried deleting the actual output folder and closing and opening the program after deleting the merge within the merge program, so it seems to be as "fresh" as it can be but it still gives me the limited output. Most of the files are still active in their original folder, so at least the lose of the texture folder isn't a huge deal, but esps that need to have their translations included are showing up with the $ at the beginning of every line in the mcm so it is giving me a few problems. I'm assuming face tints will be a problem as well.

The merges are at the bottom of the guide now and ICAO and the three patches are still merged into Immersive Citizens - AI Overhaul Merged.esp. edit: Never mind, I was a few pages behind on the changes. I didn't realize that clicking on a "recent changes" link only showed the guide as it was when that change was made.

As I understand it Loot and Degradation removes the need for Lootification while offering a much easier alternative.

It's nothing really. I told Neo Mature Skin had updated and he replied that it was just a misc file and not an actual update. I had already downloaded it and gone through my follower/npc replacers and copied the "new" files over by then. It really didn't take that long, just tedious and, ultimately, completely unnecessary on my part.

Just a misc file? Damn, I wish I would have noticed that before going through and updating all my Bijin and other npc folders as well... :-(

Thanks, I'll probably take your advice then. I'm really not looking forward to having to reinstall everything. What's really annoying is I have Steam and all the games on a separate drive but Steam still makes me reinstall everything when I do a Windows reinstall. It's probably for the best though; I haven't done a reinstall in a while and my pc could probably use a fresh start.

Sorry to keep throwing stuff at you but in "character creation menus" the option is just "XPMSE3 Plugin", without the "racemenu". It's grayed out, so you have to select it, but it's probably still going to confuse people as they follow your guide. You also have "racemenu" as the selection box heading and it's now "character creation menus". Mature skin updated today as well. Glad to hear Windows 10 is working well for you. I'll probably upgrade sometime this week. You just updated, didn't you? You mentioned getting skyrim up and running. You didn't have to reinstall any programs, did you? Or is it a new machine?

Hey Neo. What do you think of Windows 10 so far? I've been holding off updating until I hear what sort of performance the official version is giving people. It seems the link for XP32 is still going to the old version and not the extended.

I'd be interested looking at the patches also. Thanks, dreadflopp. Enjoy the rest of your holiday.

@ Pretendeavor Thanks for the info on changing the master. I just did it for the MMO patches in regards to ELE and it was a HUGE help. Thanks!