Paid mods are now available on the workshop

[Neovalen]

How much? Do you have any idea? All this new stuff actually made me want to donate a little bit something I can afford to a few selected authors, but if PayPal eats large part of it, I don't know what's worse.

It is 2.9% plus $0.30 USD of the amount you receive. For example, if you are sent $100.00 USD by credit card, the fee would be $3.20 USD ($2.90 + $0.30).

 

This was taken from PayPal's site FAQ.

[Octopuss]

That's no so bad. I was thinking something symbolic like $5.

[werewulfking]

Yeah I could have looked that up myself and now that I did it can even go down to 1% if I paid via normal debit-card or money thats already on paypal. Or really it can't as the recipient would have to pay the fee if I do it via nexus wouldn't they? So no really small fee for them or do all countries have the same conditions as in that it doesn't matter whether I am in Germany or USA when I inspect the fee between those two countries?

Edited April 24, 2015 by werewulfking

[obrother]

I'd love to have the option on Nexus to set my own automatic download fee.  Like having the options to set a donation value of 0.01 or 0.05 for each mod I download.  Even I could afford a penny per download.  It seems like nothing, but if many users did something similar, the it would certainly add up over time.  Maybe not to huge, life-changing piles of money, but probably more than most authors will ever receive in donations.

 

This seems like a good option if it was promoted effectively.  I would use it.  Nexus would probably need to be willing to support a mechanism to manage and redistribute your donation pool, but then that's probably the case regardless with any solution that relies on lots of little donations.

[keithinhanoi]

Of course Valve isn't going to let you beg for donations on their site.  That's an attempt to subvert their payment system.  They also aren't going to let you put your own Paypal buttons in the mod description.  I would have been shocked if they had allowed it.  In itself that should certainly not be taken as a threat to other sites like Nexus.

 

What I'm curious about is if they'll crack down on modders linking to free versions of their mods on Nexus.  I would sort of expect them to, since this could also be taken as a way to subvert their payment system.

There are so many posts on so many forums and comments threads everywhere, that I can't give a link, but I've read the reason why donation links given in any paid user content mods are not allowed is straight from the agreements that the Steam Workshop user has to click "agree" to in order to put mods up for sale. It basically states that the only place where the mod can be sold is on the Steam Workshop. 

 

If Valve doesn't want mod makers linking to free versions of their mods elsewhere, or even on the SW, that would mean some of those people in the initial group of paid mods will have to pull them, notably Chesko, and isoku (assuming he releases the new versions of iNeed and W&C on Nexus.)

 

 

More likely - as I think I mentioned here (or elsewhere.... losing my mind here) - Valve will ask Nexus and/or individual users to remove the donation button, at least for mods which are available as paid mods on SW.

[Octopuss]

More likely - as I think I mentioned here (or elsewhere.... losing my mind here) - Valve will ask Nexus and/or individual users to remove the donation button, at least for mods which are available as paid mods on SW.

I hope Dark0ne will laugh them in the face.

[kylhwch]

[sarcasm] Personally, I cannot wait for approval of Golden Potato, an incredible bargain at $9.99. [/sarcasm]

 

I laughed so hard I cried. In fact, I'm still crying.

 

The Internet has its own, unique, way of expressing its displeasure. The Golden Potato is just such an expression. From a sociological point of view - interesting times.

[kryptopyr]

It is 2.9% plus $0.30 USD of the amount you receive. For example, if you are sent $100.00 USD by credit card, the fee would be $3.20 USD ($2.90 + $0.30).

Yep, it's not horrendous, but if someone wants to donate a dollar or less, than that flat $0.30 fee starts becoming a fairly significant percentage.  Paypal does have a micropayment option as well (which is 5% + $0.05), but that depends entirely on how the mod author has their account set up, and I suspect most people just use the standard rate.

[xxx78]

Mods is not made by professionals and there is bugs and conflicts between mods that will make it impossible to use a mod with certain other mods. And will it be patches to fix issues and what about customer service?

Because of this facts I think mods work best with a donation system like there is on Nexus site. To make it into a paid product will create many issues and possible conflicts with consumer laws.

But in the end it is up to the producer of a product to decide what they want to do with it, and the same goes for makers of mods.

 

Personally I use many mods, not 10 or 20 but several hundred mods. I can't do that if I have to pay for all the mods. With a paying system, buying 10-20 mods will cost more than the game itself. Considering that the game itself was developed by a professional company that used several years to make a game, and that they produce patches and have a customer service, I cant defend the cost of more than a few mods.

 

What consequences this will have in the long run is uncertain but I fear that some of the community will die and that the interest around mods will decrease. I also fear that this system will be exploited by for example persons that is selling mods that they have not produced them-self. And if that happen what can valve do? kick them out? what about the players that have bought the product already?

Edited April 24, 2015 by xxx78

[oqhansoloqo]

Okay, I've just found out that regarding the question of proceeds going to the authors of tools or possibly other mods upon which a paid user content mod relies on or was built with the help of, there's an option to select from a list of "Service Providers" who will receive a percentage of Valve's revenue (not the mod author's!)

 

The list, which you can view here, is very short at the moment - just Blender, and curiously, MCM (Mod Configuration Menu). EDIT: I misunderstood what I read on that web page, and actually there are three others on the list of Service Providers, under the heading of "Communities": Nexus Mods, AFK Mods, and Polycount. The NIFScope team - well, jonwd7 - was approached by Valve asking if they wanted to be on the list, and it didn't happen in time for the launch. Read more about this and other interesting information at the AFKMods forum thread on the SW offering paid mods.

 

The same web page also addresses - in a very general way - my question about what happens when someone offers a paid user content mod on SW which uses content with a license prohibiting monetized distribution:

So I guess that takes care of any mutually conflicting licence agreements - it's the user's fault, kick them out, and make them pay for their transgressions. It still strikes me as a really big grey area when I start considering real world scenarios, however.

In the situation where a mod gets kicked out of the Steam Workshop - I wonder if the money that was paid by customers for the mod is returned to the customers or if all of the money is then kept by "Valve".  I'm guessing "Valve" pockets it and doesn't return it.

[Phyrre56]

I understand the emotions associated with this change. I want to share my perspective, because I find it calming and I'm pretty sure it's accurate. 

 

Mods to this point in history have been volunteer work. We didn't question a creator's motivation. Until now the motivation didn't matter. Some percentage created mods out of passion, and others considered it work they couldn't monetize. 

 

That second group, who considered it work they couldn't monetize, now has a monetized option. That's good! They never wanted to be doing this for free. I question why they went ahead with it but that was their choice. They are now happier with the arrangement.  

 

The passion group is still free to develop mods that are not behind a pay wall. Until Valve or Bethesda makes non-monetized modding illegal, the community will not die. The community will shrink. BUT it will shrink by subtracting the people who were never in it as a passion project anyway. 

 

The STEP community is not going to start buying garbage mods from Valve for $0.99. Uninformed players will buy bad mods, and the system will work. Some modders will get paid, probably based more on how well they market to uninformed consumers vs. actual mod quality. Some users will hate the mods they buy, smarten up, and stop buying. Some will like them and keep buying. There's nothing wrong with any of this. Everyone is participating with free will. 

 

Meanwhile those who have a passion for free modding will continue to do so. We'll lose some STEP mods. New ones will take their places. Modders who resented the system from the start will leave. It will be fine. If anything, I think the community will be stronger. Smaller but more dedicated to common principles. 

 

The despicable people in this deal are the ones stealing free content and repackaging it as their own for a price. That needs to stop. I have no idea if that's possible or feasible but I support any creator's right to defend their intellectual property and defend it strictly. I hope Valve is prepared to comply. But either way I'm not buying any mods from them. 

 

I do have faith, however, that enough people are passionate about the modding community to keep it alive and well. This isn't a terminal illness, this is evolution. 

Edited April 24, 2015 by Phyrre56

[keithinhanoi]

Interesting. In one post by Shezrie in the comments thread of her new Shezrie's Bleakden Town mod ($2.99 US default / $1.99 minimum exclusively on SW), she says that Valve allow "previous mods" to be published as paid on the SW:

Free and paid mods can coexist, there is no way that all that the Skyrim mods will turn paid overnight, Valve does not allow previous mods to be sold.

 

In the meanwhile, due to the abusive posts we've been seeing on the comments thread for any mod creator who's selling a mod on SW, she's made Old Hroldan Town hidden on Nexus and Steam until things calm down. Comments locked on her other mods, from what I can tell.

 

Also - I notice with irony that the Steam page announcing paid Skyrim mods is still displaying art from the Chesko fishing mod that he pulled over Fore's protest.

[kryptopyr]

All this speculation about the legalities and what Valve will and won't do in certain circumstances will get worked out (for better or worse).  I'm positive that Bethesda and Valve have had their lawyers looking into these issues long before they made this decision.  This isn't something they did blindly, and I'm sure they've already considered and have at least some idea of how to address most, if not all, of these issues.

 

For all of the anger directed at Valve, I think some of the things they've done show a real interest in truly wanting to support the modding community.  The ability to list contributors and designate a share of the proceeds is an incredibly important feature, even if we're currently a bit uncertain how this will work on a practical level.  The fact that they've already considered the importance of community provided tools and other utilities and have allowed modders to designate a portion of Valve's revenue to go toward these service providers is another positive sign.

 

I think this will end up being a good, or at least neutral, change to the modding community.  I think the vast majority of smaller mods will remain free (and if not, then other people will come along and make free equivalents).  However, this could well provide the added incentive for modders to create more large, dlc-quality mods, and I think that would be great thing.

 

Edit: I completely agree with Phyree56's comment.

[keithinhanoi]

The Internet has its own, unique, way of expressing its displeasure. The Golden Potato is just such an expression. From a sociological point of view - interesting times.

I've already given up on Golden Potato. Now I'm looking to get Beth in my game...

[TehKaoZ]

Figured I'd post my thoughts as well. I usually am a silent observer of the modding community, mostly helping out with the occasional troublshooting issues. But this is how I see this situation going

 

Pros: Mod authors get paid for their work, they SHOULD get paid for their work, honestly.

 

Cons:

 

- Many Mods use or pull resources from other locations, as a result you will now see a divide in these resourses such as people no longer providing free to use resources out of fear a paid mod will use it or limiting paid authors from using certain materials. This isn't just going to cause a divide in mod users, but a divide in authors as well, as we have already started seeing

 

- As others have stated. Troubleshooting and support is a HUGE part of modding, now though you may pay for something and get zero support from it. Especially since other commonly used points of support may not exist anymore for it (STEP?), but what makes this problematic is that your PAYING for something and it may break and your SOL. Modding (particularly Skyrim) is a finicky creature and charging money for something like this mine as well be like drag racing down a major freeway and hope nothing bad happens

 

- The word "community" is thrown around a lot. This will put simply, divide it. Those who are willing to pay and those who aren't. These "strong" opinions people have won't go away after a few months. Stuff may die down a bit in terms of day to day drama, but this will alienate portions of the community from each other.

 

- Pirated Mods, Ways to cheat the system in some way, these are things now

 

Other thoughts:

 

- Personally the percentage is pretty bad IMO, I would much rather pirate a mod and then donate the money I would have paid for it so they receive more of it. Even in the case of "donation version" mods, I will not use this. I honestly don't mind paying 1$ for a mod, but at the same time I won't support this system.

 

- After much thought I don't think the Skyrim modding community will benefit from this. Other games who start with a paid modding system will probably do fine, but to make Skyrim and the authors (poor Isoku) the sacrifical lamb in all this, is unfortunate

 

- I signed the petition to remove this system.

 

- Uncertain why people are suprised at how people are treating the mod authors who decided to take the plunge. We are on the internet and while Nexus moderators do a good job of removing the refuse of user's who jump on that bandwagon of hate, these people have always been around, they are just more targeted now. Plus Steam Workshop has always been pretty bad even with free mods.  Combine that with others feeling betrayed, angry, ect. It's a free for all (Minus the mods of course. heh).

 

- I think many authors (so far) posted on the workshop not out of greed but more curiousity honestly. I don't agree with those authors choices to do so, but I don't condemn them or have any sort of hateful feelings toward them. However, I stand on the side of the Nexus so I won't be supporting mods through a paywall either.

 

I'm sure most of what I said has been said already in one form or another, just felt the need to share

 

Edit: Neovalens post on the DSR page basically sums up my concerns pretty well

Edited April 24, 2015 by TehKaoZ