DynDOLOD 3.00 Alpha 182

[sheson]

7 hours ago, Mousetick said:

1920x1200 (16:10), AMD RX 580 8GB, Adrenalin 22.6.1 (2022-06-22), All driver settings set to default in AMD tool, No additional AMD crapware.

I'm using the Windows port of DXVK (DirectX-to-Vulkan) and immediately thought that could be the culprit, so I tested again without it, it was the same.

I'm not quite sure what you're asking, but it went like this: I generated LODs with TexGen + DynDOLOD, enabled DynDOLOD plugins, and started new game to check the LODs (until then I'd been testing the mods and game without DynDOLOD, only with xLODGen terrain LOD + vanilla LODs). I walked normally around Riverwood and Whiterun, and noticed the lines/crosses on the treetops of the pine tree LODs against the clear sky background. I walked normally some more, closer and further from the trees, to make sure it's wasn't a fluke and confirm they were LOD-related. I then turned on free camera to get closer and take some screenshots.

The artifacts are still present after quitting/restarting/reloading the game.

I hope that answers your question? I can do some more walking around if that's useful, in other places, like Falkreath or Haafingar.

Note: I play without AA, which probably makes it more noticeable. I could try turning on FXAA and/or TAA to see what difference it makes. Not that I would play with it, but out of curiosity.

To give you a better idea perhaps, here are a couple shots taken from the ground at normal viewing distance (no free camera):

See if you can spot the artifacts.

Let me know if you'd like to try some things in particular. I'm not currently playing the game, I'm still testing/finalizing the load order, so I don't mind.

But I wouldn't be too surprised if it were GPU-related, in which case further investigation and tests might be pointless.

Thanks.

Will be fixed next version. The mipmap generation is wrapping the texture instead of clamping it.

[Mousetick]

6 hours ago, sheson said:

Will be fixed next version. The mipmap generation is wrapping the texture instead of clamping it.

That's cool. I'm glad you were able to pin down the bug, and it sounds like it was a very simple fix, which is even better.

So the billboard mipmap's top contained bits of the texture's bottom, and my combination of aspect ratio + FOV caused one more mipmap line to be rendered. Am I grokking this?

16:10 is pretty uncommon these days. I'm not sure if it's still manufactured. That's too bad. It's good for gaming but mostly great for programming/writing or general computing. Luckily for me I use a DELL Pro flat-panel that's built like a tank and won't die, 11-years old and counting.

Thanks for looking into this issue and fixing it.

[sheson]

1 hour ago, Mousetick said:

That's cool. I'm glad you were able to pin down the bug, and it sounds like it was a very simple fix, which is even better.

So the billboard mipmap's top contained bits of the texture's bottom, and my combination of aspect ratio + FOV caused one more mipmap line to be rendered. Am I grokking this?

16:10 is pretty uncommon these days. I'm not sure if it's still manufactured. That's too bad. It's good for gaming but mostly great for programming/writing or general computing. Luckily for me I use a DELL Pro flat-panel that's built like a tank and won't die, 11-years old and counting.

Thanks for looking into this issue and fixing it.

I think tree size, billboard (mipmap) resolution, screen resolutions (and actual physical pixel size), fov and whatever AAs plus distance just visually hides it for most people. I am not sure when this regression started either.

[Mousetick]

Now that the mipmap issue is taken care of, let's move on to the next issue

Lush Vanilla Trees is listed on https://dyndolod.info/Help/Ultra-Tree-LOD among "mods that are known and tested to contain hybrid trees." In my experience, it hasn't worked out. The mod doesn't provide any documentation for 3D LODs, the MA has been apparently inactive for a long time, there are probably 2 or 3 other users beside me - basically it's a dead mod, so it's DIY time.

As you may have noticed in my Object_Report.txt while troubleshooting the mipmap bug, DynDOLOD fails to find the 3D LOD meshes for each TreePineForest TREE, as shown below for example:

Spoiler

TreePineForest01 [TREE:0001306D] Meshes\landscape\trees\treepineforest01.nif [CRC32:34A5CAFB] using textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbranchcomp.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbranchcomp_n.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbarkcomp.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbarkcomp_n.dds 
	Replaced tree, Billboard found, 3D LOD model not found treepineforest01_34A5CAFB
	Billboard_0: textures\terrain\lodgen\skyrim.esm\treepineforest01_0001306d.dds, textures\default_n.dds
	Billboard_1: textures\terrain\lodgen\skyrim.esm\treepineforest01_0001306d_1.dds, textures\terrain\lodgen\skyrim.esm\treepineforest01_0001306d_1_n.dds
	Billboard_2: textures\terrain\lodgen\skyrim.esm\treepineforest01_0001306d_2.dds, textures\terrain\lodgen\skyrim.esm\treepineforest01_0001306d_2_n.dds
	Dynamic: Meshes\landscape\trees\treepineforest01.nif using textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbranchcomp.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbranchcomp_n.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbarkcomp.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbarkcomp_n.dds
	LOD4: Billboard1 using internal
	LOD8: Billboard4 using dyndolod_flat_4x2_lod.nif
	LOD16: Billboard1 using internal

The mod does come with 3D LOD meshes (and some pre-rendered billboards, which I promptly threw away):

Spoiler

As you can see above, some meshes contain CRC32 and others not. The ones containing CRC32 are for custom full models enabled with a plugin. I'm not using any of that. The other ones, without CRC32 are for vanilla full model replacers, without plugin. I'm using those full model replacers.

This is treepineforest01passthru_lod.nif in NifSkope, for example. It looks fine to me, but I wouldn't know if it were wrong:

Spoiler

Using 7Zip's CRC32 feature, I got the CRC32 of treepineforest01.nif and it is indeed 34A5CAFB.

Questions:

• Can I just insert the corresponding CRC32 into each 3D LOD mesh filename? For example:

treepineforest01passthru_lod.nif > treepineforest01_34A5CAFBpassthru_lod.nif

Thanks.

[sheson]

1 hour ago, Mousetick said:

Now that the mipmap issue is taken care of, let's move on to the next issue

Lush Vanilla Trees is listed on https://dyndolod.info/Help/Ultra-Tree-LOD among "mods that are known and tested to contain hybrid trees." In my experience, it hasn't worked out. The mod doesn't provide any documentation for 3D LODs, the MA has been apparently inactive for a long time, there are probably 2 or 3 other users beside me - basically it's a dead mod, so it's DIY time.

As you may have noticed in my Object_Report.txt while troubleshooting the mipmap bug, DynDOLOD fails to find the 3D LOD meshes for each TreePineForest TREE, as shown below for example:

  Hide contents

TreePineForest01 [TREE:0001306D] Meshes\landscape\trees\treepineforest01.nif [CRC32:34A5CAFB] using textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbranchcomp.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbranchcomp_n.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbarkcomp.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbarkcomp_n.dds 
	Replaced tree, Billboard found, 3D LOD model not found treepineforest01_34A5CAFB
	Billboard_0: textures\terrain\lodgen\skyrim.esm\treepineforest01_0001306d.dds, textures\default_n.dds
	Billboard_1: textures\terrain\lodgen\skyrim.esm\treepineforest01_0001306d_1.dds, textures\terrain\lodgen\skyrim.esm\treepineforest01_0001306d_1_n.dds
	Billboard_2: textures\terrain\lodgen\skyrim.esm\treepineforest01_0001306d_2.dds, textures\terrain\lodgen\skyrim.esm\treepineforest01_0001306d_2_n.dds
	Dynamic: Meshes\landscape\trees\treepineforest01.nif using textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbranchcomp.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbranchcomp_n.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbarkcomp.dds, textures\landscape\trees\treepineforestbarkcomp_n.dds
	LOD4: Billboard1 using internal
	LOD8: Billboard4 using dyndolod_flat_4x2_lod.nif
	LOD16: Billboard1 using internal

The mod does come with 3D LOD meshes (and some pre-rendered billboards, which I promptly threw away):

  Hide contents

As you can see above, some meshes contain CRC32 and others not. The ones containing CRC32 are for custom full models enabled with a plugin. I'm not using any of that. The other ones, without CRC32 are for vanilla full model replacers, without plugin. I'm using those full model replacers.

This is treepineforest01passthru_lod.nif in NifSkope, for example. It looks fine to me, but I wouldn't know if it were wrong:

  Hide contents

Using 7Zip's CRC32 feature, I got the CRC32 of treepineforest01.nif and it is indeed 34A5CAFB.

Questions:

• Can I just insert the corresponding CRC32 into each 3D LOD mesh filename? For example:

treepineforest01passthru_lod.nif > treepineforest01_34A5CAFBpassthru_lod.nif

Thanks.

As the link gives away the Skyrim version was tested many years ago for DynDOLOD 2.x

https://dyndolod.info/Help/3D-Tree-LOD-Model explains the CRC32 filename convention. The CRC32 just needs to be inserted into the filename between _ and passthru.nif

[Mousetick]

3 hours ago, sheson said:

https://dyndolod.info/Help/3D-Tree-LOD-Model explains the CRC32 filename convention. The CRC32 just needs to be inserted into the filename between _ and passthru.nif

Thanks for the confirmation. Everything's peachy now after inserting the CRC32s.

3 hours ago, sheson said:

As the link gives away the Skyrim version was tested many years ago for DynDOLOD 2.x

Yes, I'm aware it's an old LE mod.

However it's also available on Skyrim SE Nexus, which is how I came across this mod. Someone simply re-uploaded it there, with the original MA's permission. It's identical to the LE original (same file dates, etc.) So the fact that LVT is listed on https://dyndolod.info/Help/Ultra-Tree-LOD can cause some confusion in people's mind as to its viability with DynDOLOD 3. Not everyone is as smart, knowledgeable or resourceful as you or the folks hosting this community.

As this post demonstrates, from not long ago:

Quote

Can't seem to get the 3d lods working with Dyndolod 3.0...

I doubt the user was ever able to make it work on their own.

It's obviously impossible to keep track of, and support, all tree mods ever published. I'm simply bringing the issue with this particular mod to your attention, in case you deem it appropriate to act upon it.

I'd humbly suggest two options for your consideration:

• Remove LVT from https://dyndolod.info/Help/Ultra-Tree-LOD, or add a qualified note to indicate it's only compatible with DynDOLOD 2.x.
• Add LVT SE to https://dyndolod.info/Help/Ultra-Tree-LOD and include the 3D LOD meshes with CRC32 filenames into DynDOLOD 3 Resources, as they are open permissions and the full models are unlikely to ever be updated. Just like the SBT 3D LOD meshes are included in DynDOLOD 3 Resources.

Just my 2 cents. Thanks.

[sheson]

3 hours ago, Mousetick said:

As this post demonstrates, from not long ago:

I doubt the user was ever able to make it work on their own.

What the post demonstrates is that users not following the official instructions to ask on the official DynDOLOD support forum to get qualified answers and help or to report issues.

3 hours ago, Mousetick said:

It's obviously impossible to keep track of, and support, all tree mods ever published. I'm simply bringing the issue with this particular mod to your attention, in case you deem it appropriate to act upon it.

This is the way.

[Khermiit]

Master Sheson,

I very recently built a new pc and tried to run TexGen this morning for the first time on the new machine. It crashes back to MO2 screen after reaching the "create textures" phase. There were no logs generated in the DynDOLOD folder. I worked through your suggestions here and I think I found the issue, but am at a loss as to how to fix it. It does NOT appear to be DynDOLOD's fault at all, but an issue with Nvidia OpenGL driver? I have the latest nvidia drivers installed(12/6/22).

These are the event log entries when it crashes.

 

Could you spare a minute to help? Thank you.

Edited December 16, 2022 by Khermiit
Image fix

[sheson]

3 hours ago, Khermiit said:

Master Sheson,

I very recently built a new pc and tried to run TexGen this morning for the first time on the new machine. It crashes back to MO2 screen after reaching the "create textures" phase. There were no logs generated in the DynDOLOD folder. I worked through your suggestions here and I think I found the issue, but am at a loss as to how to fix it. It does NOT appear to be DynDOLOD's fault at all, but an issue with Nvidia OpenGL driver? I have the latest nvidia drivers installed(12/6/22).

These are the event log entries when it crashes.

 

Could you spare a minute to help? Thank you.

https://dyndolod.info/FAQ "High memory usage / Out of memory"
Use the x64 versions of the tools. Let the OS handle virtual memory/page file settings. Close other programs and background processes.
If TexGen runs out of memory, add a line TextureCache=10 to ..\DynDOLOD\Edit Scripts\DynDOLOD\TexGen_[GAME MODE].INI. Try lower settings. Make sure as much video memory as possible is available by closing other programs.

[vektor9999]

Hey guys,

I noticed that sometimes the grass lod completely disappears for like a 1 second before the full grass models are rendered for a given area.

Is this something we can fix?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Edited December 16, 2022 by vektor9999

[sheson]

2 minutes ago, vektor9999 said:

Hey guys,

I noticed that sometimes the grass lod completely disappears for like a 1 second before the full grass model is rendered for an area.

Is this something we can fix?

Thanks in advance for your help.

https://dyndolod.info/How-LOD-Works

The game does not know that grass has LOD and that object LOD should only be disabled for the cell once grass loaded.

Make full grass load faster by using the grass cache.

[vektor9999]

12 minutes ago, sheson said:

https://dyndolod.info/How-LOD-Works

The game does not know that grass has LOD and that object LOD should only be disabled for the cell once grass loaded.

Make full grass load faster by using the grass cache.

OK, i understand but as i use seasons i cannot use the grass cache (except for generating the grass lods) and use the default game engine to generate grass as you suggested here (https://dyndolod.info/Help/Seasons)

So i guess no option for me then?

Edited December 16, 2022 by vektor9999

[sheson]

48 minutes ago, vektor9999 said:

OK, i understand but as i use seasons i cannot use the grass cache (except for generating the grass lods) and use the default game engine to generate grass as you suggested here (https://dyndolod.info/Help/Seasons)

So i guess no option for me then?

No cache then. Make sure to set [Grass] bEnableGrassFade=0

[Mousetick]

Following up on 3D LOD models from Lush Vanilla Trees, I'm not going to use them after all for various reasons which have nothing to do with DynDOLOD: they don't use my textures, they use textures\dyndolod\lod\dyndolodtreelod.dds and they're much too bright. It would take forever to redo the UV mappings, tweak the vertex colors, and I don't have the tools or skills to do it anyway.

I'm thinking of cheating and copying the vanilla 3D LOD models from DynDOLOD Resources, then insert the CRC32s from LVT models on the copies' filenames. They won't have the same number of branches as LVT, but they look much better brightness-wise and they use the user's textures. The discrepancy in "lushiness" is probably going to look very wrong in-game, but it's worth a try.

Questions:

• Out of curiosity, what is textures\dyndolod\lod\dyndolodtreelod.dds in DynDOLOD Resources? It appears to be an atlas of vanilla tree textures. What is it used for normally? Isn't it strange that the 3D LOD models of LVT are using it, or is it a legacy of DynDOLOD 2.x maybe?
• Are there any gotchas from fooling DynDOLOD by using CRC32s from other full models, other than breaking the rules and causing support headaches for you? 

Thanks.

[sheson]

28 minutes ago, Mousetick said:

Following up on 3D LOD models from Lush Vanilla Trees, I'm not going to use them after all for various reasons which have nothing to do with DynDOLOD: they don't use my textures, they use textures\dyndolod\lod\dyndolodtreelod.dds and they're much too bright. It would take forever to redo the UV mappings, tweak the vertex colors, and I don't have the tools or skills to do it anyway.

I'm thinking of cheating and copying the vanilla 3D LOD models from DynDOLOD Resources, then insert the CRC32s from LVT models on the copies' filenames. They won't have the same number of branches as LVT, but they look much better brightness-wise and they use the user's textures. The discrepancy in "lushiness" is probably going to look very wrong in-game, but it's worth a try.

Questions:

• Out of curiosity, what is textures\dyndolod\lod\dyndolodtreelod.dds in DynDOLOD Resources? It appears to be an atlas of vanilla tree textures. What is it used for normally? Isn't it strange that the 3D LOD models of LVT are using it, or is it a legacy of DynDOLOD 2.x maybe?
• Are there any gotchas from fooling DynDOLOD by using CRC32s from other full models, other than breaking the rules and causing support headaches for you? 

Thanks.

Being able to render textures is a new feature. Read ..\Skyrim\DynDOLOD\Docs\trees.ultra\tools\DynDOLOD_CreateStaticTree.html in the DynDOLOD 2 archive about using the manually created atlas texture for 3D tree LOD creation and then read https://dyndolod.info/Help/3D-Tree-LOD-Model for the new process separating full trees into trunk and crown meshes.

Do not use, rename or make available 3D tree LOD models with a CRC32 in the filename that do not match their full model. Create matching 3D tree LOD models from the full models or use automatically generated billboards. The CRC32 solves the problem of users being unable to deal with overwrite orders and mixing and merging different tree mods or versions. When people complain about generating LOD being complicated, this is the main reason. Do not add to the number of mods doing things wrong on purpose or because of ignorance.

If the solution to a problem is to do something wrong on purpose, then you are wasting your time and the time of others. Spend that time to learn and how to do things properly right away.

https://dyndolod.info/Mod-Authors