Large Refs Skyrim SE - DynDOLOD Setting

[z929669]

I have read through the forums and searched this topic. I understand that Skyrim does not differential near grid from far grid but only uGrids from far grid, so dynamic LOD only applies outside of uGrids. Skyrim SE differentiates uGrids, near grid, and far grid

I still don't fully comprehend:

Quote

 

As a rule of thumb, check the box "Upgrade NearGrid Large Refs" in case the large reference system is not used - uLargeRefLODGridSize = uGridsToLoad - to make sure all references receive dynamic LOD as intended. The result would be LOD working the same as it did in Skyrim.

Vice versa, do not check the box "Upgrade NearGrid Large Refs" in case the large referene system is used - uLargeRefLODGridSize > uGridsToLoad >= 5. Upgrading large references that were intended for NearGrid means more resource usage in case the large reference system is used. References that are intended for NearGrid are typically smaller and it generally makes not much sense to show them beyond the large reference grid.

...

In the Skyrim version the NearGrid and FarGrid of the dynamic LOD system start right beyond the uGridsToLoad. In Skyrim Special Edition the FarGrid starts beyond the uLargeRefLODGridSize, while the NearGrid still starts beyond the uGridsToLoad.

This means that for a worldspace which has any large refrences, the dynamic LOD for a large reference is always assigned to FarGrid, while dynamic LOD for normal reference is always assigned to the NearGrid. Consequently this will overwrite mesh rules grid settings automatically on a per reference basis as needed. If the worldspace has no large references, the grid settings are used as intended.

For example, a mesh rule might define "Far LOD" or "Far Full" for a mesh in case it needs to be dynamic LOD. If the reference using this mesh is not a large reference, it will automatically assigned to the NearGrid.

 

Checking the box

• Does this automatically set uLargeRefLODGridSize = uGridsToLoad in the background, because the settings GUI do not reflect this ... perhaps it is advice to consider doing so manually?
• "Near Grid" = uLargeRefLODGridSize?
• This claims "better visualizations" in the DynDOLOD GUI, can you elaborate?
• A large ref object is flagged as such by the plugin, and it has LOD:
  • what happens inside uGrids and uLargeRefLODGridSize? Potential for z-fight only in the latter? Setting both to '5' resolves? At what cost to visualizations and/or performance?
  • What is the advantage of SSE uLargeRefLODGridSize (pretend the large ref bug doesn't exist and this works perfectly)
  • What is the disadvantage, given the LR bug in SE?

NOT checking the box

• "in case the large referene system is used" - in SE the large reference system IS used, so this phrase confuses me.
• Mesh rule assigning a large ref to near grid will be overriden and vice versa?
• This setting is ideal if and only if all large refs are flagged properly by the 'winning' plugin? (otherwise, either fix each or "check the box"?

*For best quality it seems that "Upgrade NearGrid Large Refs" SHOULD be ticked and uLargeRefLODGridSize > uGridsToLoad >= 5 ... is this correct? Is the caveat that there may be some z-fighting for large refs improperly flagged?

*For best performance, it seems like "Upgrade NearGrid Large Refs" SHOULD NOT be ticked and uLargeRefLODGridSize > uGridsToLoad >= 5 STILL should be used. To avoid the LOD/full large ref conflic problem, then we can do uLargeRefLODGridSize = uGridsToLoad to fix the large ref issue at the cost of some performance ... is this correct?

[sheson]

41 minutes ago, z929669 said:

To confirm:

Large ref system is in effect only in NearGrid range (11 to 21 cells by default)?

Setting "NearGidToLoad" = uGrids turns OFF the large ref system, and setting to any value higher than uGrids turns it on?

Ticking "Upgrade NearGrid Large Refs" when the large ref system is OFF ensures that dynamic LOD shows beyond uGrids up to but not beyond FarGrid?

Ticking "Upgrade NearGrid Large Refs" when the large ref system is ON ensures that dynamic LOD shows beyond NearGrid up to but not beyond FarGrid?

 

Near grid is a concept of DynDOLOD.
The large ref grid  has whatever size is set for uLargeRefLODGridSize in the SkyrimPrefs.INI. The launcher defaults are from 5 to 11.

The Near Grid and a Far Grid setting in DynDOLOD do not affect the uGridsToLoad or uLargeRefLODGridSize INI settings or systems.
They exist to control dynamic LOD of DynDOLOD. Nothing else.

Upgrade NearGrid Large Refs checkbox makes any large reference that was supposed to only show in the Near Grid show to the Far Grid distance. It does not matter if the large ref system is on or off.

DynDOLOD3/docs/help/Advanced.html:
Unchecked large references that would have dynamic LOD in the NearGrid are ignored. They will not have LOD beyond the large reference distance setting.
Checked large references that would have dynamic LOD in the NearGrid are added to the FarGrid. They will have LOD beyond the large reference distance setting.

[sheson]

The terms near and far grid are sole concepts of DynDOLOD. 
DynDOLOD does not change any INI settings.
Upgraded large references show further away to the far grid distance instead to the near distance, which means more stuff in the distance and more resource usage.  If the large reference system is used, there is typically no need to extend their distance beyond the near grid as the near grid distance is deemed sufficient (because they are typically smaller objects).
The uGrids is the active cells which always shows full models. The LargeRefGrid shows full models or large references outside the uGrids if it is larger.
 For normal large ref grid sizes, the visuals are a bit better because full models switch to LOD model a bit further out, at the cost of more performance requirements and sometimes really bad decals that are not fading which both gets worse with greater large ref distance.
The large reference system is not visually active anymore, e.g. not used when its size is equal to the uGrids size.
If the upgrade option is not checked, then near grid large refs will not be upgraded. In case the large ref system is off, it means these reference actually do not show any dynamic LOD outside the active cells. Hence the suggestion to check the box to upgrade them, so they show outside the uGrids to the far grid distance instead not at all. This is all became necessary because of side effects of the large ref system.
What is considered good quality is personal preference and depends on load order. Typically it is nice to have ful  models load a couple cells further out with the large ref system. It goes to hell once you notice the decals (can be undone by unsetting NoFade in the shader flags for the affect models) and especially if large reference bugs are triggered everywhere - which is mostly solvable by making plugins ESM and avoiding the other causes. I documented the bugs and main fix 2016, how there are still so many visually incompatible plugins triggering them I dunno.

[z929669]

16 hours ago, sheson said:

The terms near and far grid are sole concepts of DynDOLOD. 
DynDOLOD does not change any INI settings.
Upgraded large references show further away to the far grid distance instead to the near distance, which means more stuff in the distance and more resource usage.  If the large reference system is used, there is typically no need to extend their distance beyond the near grid as the near grid distance is deemed sufficient (because they are typically smaller objects).
The uGrids is the active cells which always shows full models. The LargeRefGrid shows full models or large references outside the uGrids if it is larger.
 For normal large ref grid sizes, the visuals are a bit better because full models switch to LOD model a bit further out, at the cost of more performance requirements and sometimes really bad decals that are not fading which both gets worse with greater large ref distance.
The large reference system is not visually active anymore, e.g. not used when its size is equal to the uGrids size.
If the upgrade option is not checked, then near grid large refs will not be upgraded. In case the large ref system is off, it means these reference actually do not show any dynamic LOD outside the active cells. Hence the suggestion to check the box to upgrade them, so they show outside the uGrids to the far grid distance instead not at all. This is all became necessary because of side effects of the large ref system.
What is considered good quality is personal preference and depends on load order. Typically it is nice to have ful  models load a couple cells further out with the large ref system. It goes to hell once you notice the decals (can be undone by unsetting NoFade in the shader flags for the affect models) and especially if large reference bugs are triggered everywhere - which is mostly solvable by making plugins ESM and avoiding the other causes. I documented the bugs and main fix 2016, how there are still so many visually incompatible plugins triggering them I dunno.

To confirm:

Large ref system is in effect only in NearGrid range (11 to 21 cells by default)?

Setting "NearGidToLoad" = uGrids turns OFF the large ref system, and setting to any value higher than uGrids turns it on?

Ticking "Upgrade NearGrid Large Refs" when the large ref system is OFF ensures that dynamic LOD shows beyond uGrids up to but not beyond FarGrid?

Ticking "Upgrade NearGrid Large Refs" when the large ref system is ON ensures that dynamic LOD shows beyond NearGrid up to but not beyond FarGrid?