Crashes south, east, and southeast of Whiterun

[A_Dim_Mismatch]

In the vicinity spanning just west of Pelagia Farm, northeast to Battle-Born Farm and southeast to the pathway to Whiterun just beyond the crossing north of Riverwood, I've been experiencing pretty frequent crashes. No ini tweaks, bugfixes, etc. (even a clean Skyrim installation) that I've yet implemented appear to address this problem. Oddly, the crashes don't appear to occur anywhere else in-game. Resource-heavy interiors and exteriors elsewhere in the game have been stable outside of the usual FPS drops.

 

Using information from the Crash Fixes forums on the Nexus, I put together a dump file which pointed to an ID of 0x000aef0c. Looking up the aef0c ID in TES5Edit gives me a tree from Skyrim.esm. I'm not sure how this could be the cause of the crash. I can include the contents of the dump file for more information, if needed. This particular error is one that I have seen other people report, but no research on the matter points to anything in particular being the cause, or anything being a solution.

 

 

Below is my load order, per LOOT:

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

  0  0 Skyrim.esm

  1  1 Update.esm

  2  2 Dawnguard.esm

  3  3 HearthFires.esm

  4  4 Dragonborn.esm

  5  5 Unofficial Skyrim Legendary Edition Patch.esp

  6  6 ClimatesOfTamriel.esm

  7  7 moonpath.esm

  8  8 ApachiiHair.esm

  9  9 ApachiiHairFemales.esm

 10  a ApachiiHairMales.esm

 11  b ETaC - RESOURCES.esm

 12  c HighResTexturePack01.esp

 13  d HighResTexturePack02.esp

 14  e HighResTexturePack03.esp

 15  f Unofficial High Resolution Patch.esp

 16 10 Cutting Room Floor.esp

 17 11 SkyUI.esp

 18 12 When Vampires Attack.esp

 19 13 FNIS.esp

 20 14 RaceMenu.esp

 21 15 RaceMenuPlugin.esp

 22 16 dD - Realistic Ragdoll Force - Medium.esp

 23 17 XPMSE.esp

 24 18 MainMenu.esp

 25 19 ClimatesOfTamriel-Dawnguard-Patch.esp

 26 1a ClimatesOfTamriel-Dragonborn-Patch.esp

 27 1b EnhancedLightsandFX.esp

 28 1c ELFX - Exteriors.esp

 29 1d TreaclemanMoonpathPatch.esp

 30 1e CoT-WeatherPatch.esp

 31 1f CoT-WeatherPatch_DB.esp

 32 20 CoT-WeatherPatch_NL2.esp

 33 21 CoT-WeatherPatch_Snow-40.esp

 34 22 TrueStorms.esp

 35 23 TrueStorms-ClimatesOfTamriel.esp

 36 24 Skyrim Particle Patch for ENB - Flame Atronach Fix.esp

 37 25 Prometheus_No_snow_Under_the_roof.esp

 38 26 Complete Crafting Overhaul_Remade.esp

 39 27 SkyFalls + SkyMills + DG + DB.esp

 40 28 SkyFalls Dragonborn Small waterfalls.esp

 41 29 RealisticWaterTwo.esp

 42 2a ELFXEnhancer.esp

 43 2b ETaC - Falkreath.esp

 44 2c ETaC - Dawnstar.esp

 45 2d Immersive Orc Strongholds.esp

 46 2e ETaC - Morthal.esp

 47 2f ETaC - Rorikstead.esp

 48 30 ETaC - Dragon Bridge.esp

 49 31 RealisticNeedsandDiseases.esp

 50 32 FNISspells.esp

 51 33 ETaC - Kynesgrove.esp

 52 34 SFO - Expanded Diversity.esp

 53 35 ETaC - Ivarstead.esp

 54 36 ETaC - Winterhold.esp

 55 37 ETaC - Darkwater Crossing.esp

 56 38 ETaC - Karthwasten.esp

 57 39 Immersive Stonehills.esp

 58 3a ETaC - Falkreath ELFX Patch.esp

 59 3b RealisticWaterTwo - Legendary.esp

 60 3c Immersive Shors Stone.esp

 61 3d Run For Your Lives.esp

 62 3e SMIM-Merged-All.esp

 63 3f UFO - Ultimate Follower Overhaul.esp

 64 40 moonpath_questdata.esp

 65 41 ELFX - Moonpath.esp

 66 42 Guard Dialogue Overhaul.esp

 67 43 ETaC - Stonehills CRF Patch.esp

 68 44 ETaC - Dawnstar NoSnow Patch.esp

 69 45 ETaC - Morthal ELFX Patch.esp

 70 46 ETaC - Morthal NoSnow Patch.esp

 71 47 ETaC - Dragon Bridge South.esp

 72 48 ETaC - Dawnstar ELFX Patch.esp

 73 49 ETaC - Dragon Bridge ELFX Patch.esp

 74 4a ETaC - Winterhold NoSnow Patch.esp

 75 4b ETaC - Rorikstead ELFX Patch.esp

 76 4c ETaC - Stonehills NoSnow Patch.esp

 77 4d ETaC - Ivarstead ELFX Patch.esp

 78 4e ETaC - Winterhold ELFX Patch.esp

 79 4f ETaC - Shors Stone ELFX Patch.esp

 80 50 ETaC - Stonehills ELFX Patch.esp

 81 51 ETaC - Karthwasten ELFX Patch.esp

 82 52 ETaC - Kynesgrove ELFX Patch.esp

 83 53 ETaC - Darkwater Crossing ELFX Patch.esp

 84 54 Apocalypse - The Spell Package.esp

 85 55 Improved Dragon Shouts - Dawnguard.esp

 86 56 Improved Dragon Shouts.esp

 87 57 Improved Dragon Shouts - Dragonborn.esp

 88 58 Convenient Horses.esp

 89 59 360WalkandRunPlus-RunBackwardSpeedAdjust.esp

 90 5a VioLens.esp

 91 5b KS Hairdo's.esp

 92 5c LovelyHairstylesCE.esp

 93 5d Beards.esp

 94 5e aMidianborn_Skyforge_Weapons.esp

 95 5f RND_ETaC-Patch.esp

 96 60 RND_CRF-Patch.esp

 97 61 dD - Enhanced Blood Main.esp

 98 62 dD-Dragonborn-Dawnguard-EBT Patch.esp

 99 63 dD-Reduced Wound Size.esp

100 64 UFO - Dragonborn AddOn.esp

101 65 SFO - Dragonborn.esp

102 66 Skyrim Flora Overhaul.esp

103 67 Alternate Start - Live Another Life.esp

104 68 ETaC - Rorikstead AS-LAL Patch.esp

 

 

 

Below are Skyrim.ini and SkyrimPrefs.ini, respectively:

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

[Archive]
bInvalidateOlderFiles=0
SInvalidationFile=ArchiveInvalidation.txt
sResourceArchiveList=Skyrim - Misc.bsa, Skyrim - Shaders.bsa, Skyrim - Textures.bsa, Skyrim - Interface.bsa, Skyrim - Animations.bsa, Skyrim - Meshes.bsa, Skyrim - Sounds.bsa
sResourceArchiveList2=Skyrim - Voices.bsa, Skyrim - VoicesExtra.bsa
 
[Audio]
fMenuModeFadeInTime=1.0
fMenuModeFadeOutTime=3.0
fMusicDuckingSeconds=6.0
fMusicUnDuckingSeconds=8.0
 
[Camera]
fMouseWheelZoomSpeed=0.80
 
[Combat]
f1PArrowTiltUpAngle=2
f1PBoltTiltUpAngle=1
f3PArrowTiltUpAngle=2.5
fMagnetismLookingMult=0.0
fMagnetismStrafeHeadingMult=0.0
 
[Controls]
fMouseHeadingSensitivityMax=0.0800
fMouseHeadingXScale=0.0200
fMouseHeadingYScale=0.8500
 
[Display]
iPresentinterval=1
bAllowScreenshot=1
fLightLODMaxStartFade=3900
fLightLODRange=3600
fShadowLODMaxStartFade=1000.0
fSpecularLODMaxStartFade=2000.0
fSunShadowUpdateTime=1
fSunUpdateThreshold=0.5
 
[General]
sLanguage=ENGLISH
uExterior Cell Buffer=36
uGridsToLoad=5
 
[GeneralWarnings]
SGeneralMasterMismatchWarning=One or more plugins could not find the correct versions of the master files they depend on. Errors may occur during load or game play. Check the "Warnings.txt" file for more information.
 
[Grass]
bAllowCreateGrass=1
bAllowLoadGrass=0
fGrassFadeRange=6000
iMaxGrassTypesPerTexure=7
iMinGrassSize=40
 
[LOD]
fDistanceMultiplier=1.00
 
[Papyrus]
bEnableLogging=0
bEnableTrace=0
bLoadDebugInformation=0
fPostLoadUpdateTimeMS=500.0
 
[Water]
bReflectLODLand=1
bReflectLODObjects=1
bReflectLODTrees=1
bReflectSky=1

[AudioMenu]
fAudioMasterVolume=1.0000
fVal0=0.8000
fVal1=1.0000
fVal2=0.5500
fVal3=1.0000
fVal4=1.0000
fVal5=1.0000
fVal6=1.0000
fVal7=1.0000
uID0=1007612
uID1=554685
uID2=466532
uID3=94881
uID4=688070838
uID5=688072216
uID6=688070834
uID7=688070837
 
[Clouds]
fCloudLevel0Distance=16384.0000
fCloudLevel1Distance=32768.0000
fCloudLevel2Distance=262144.0000
fCloudNearFadeDistance=9000.0000
 
[Controls]
bAlwaysRunByDefault=1
bGamePadRumble=1
bInvertYValues=0
bUseKinect=0
fGamepadHeadingSensitivity=1.0000
fMouseHeadingSensitivity=0.0300
 
[Decals]
uMaxDecals=1000
 
[Display]
bDeferredShadows=1
bDrawLandShadows=1
bDrawShadows=1
bFloatPointRenderTarget=1
bFull Screen=1
bFXAAEnabled=0
bMainZPrepass=0
bShadowMaskZPrepass=0
bShadowsOnGrass=1
bTransparencyMultisampling=0
bTreesReceiveShadows=1
fDecalLOD1=1000.0000
fDecalLOD2=1500.0000
fGamma=1.2400
fInteriorShadowDistance=3000.0000
fLeafAnimDampenDistEnd=4600.0000
fLeafAnimDampenDistStart=3600.0000
fLightLODStartFade=400.0000
fMeshLODFadeBoundDefault=256.0000
fMeshLODFadePercentDefault=1.2000
fMeshLODLevel1FadeDist=10000000.0000
fMeshLODLevel1FadeTreeDistance=2844.0000
fMeshLODLevel2FadeDist=10000000.0000
fMeshLODLevel2FadeTreeDistance=2048.0000
fShadowBiasScale=0.1500
fShadowDistance=8000.0000
fShadowLODStartFade=200.0000
fSpecularLODStartFade=2000.0000
fTreesMidLODSwitchDist=10000000.0000
iBlurDeferredShadowMask=3
iMaxAnisotropy=1
iMaxDecalsPerFrame=100
iMaxSkinDecalsPerFrame=25
iMultiSample=0
iScreenShotIndex=2
iShadowFilter=3
iShadowMapResolution=4096
iShadowMaskQuarter=4
iShadowMode=3
iSize H=1080
iSize W=1920
iTexMipMapMinimum=0
iTexMipMapSkip=0
iWaterMultiSamples=0
sD3DDevice="NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970"
 
[GamePlay]
bShowFloatingQuestMarkers=1
bShowQuestMarkers=1
iDifficulty=2
 
[General]
bEnableStoryManagerLogging=0
iStoryManagerLoggingEvent=-1
 
[Grass]
b30GrassVS=1
bAllowCreateGrass=1
bAllowLoadGrass=0
fGrassMaxStartFadeDistance=6000.0000
fGrassMinStartFadeDistance=0.0000
fGrassStartFadeDistance=3600.0002
 
[Imagespace]
bDoDepthOfField=1
 
[Interface]
bDialogueSubtitles=0
bGeneralSubtitles=0
bShowCompass=1
fMouseCursorSpeed=1.0000
 
[Launcher]
bEnableFileSelection=1
bShowAllResolutions=1
uLastAspectRatio=3
 
[LOD]
fLODFadeOutMultActors=15.0000
fLODFadeOutMultItems=15.0000
fLODFadeOutMultObjects=15.0000
fLODFadeOutMultSkyCell=1.0000
 
[MAIN]
bCrosshairEnabled=1
bGamepadEnable=1
bSaveOnPause=1
bSaveOnRest=1
bSaveOnTravel=1
bSaveOnWait=1
fHUDOpacity=1.0000
fSkyCellRefFadeDistance=150000.0000
 
[Particles]
iMaxDesired=750
 
[SaveGame]
fAutosaveEveryXMins=15.0000
 
[TerrainManager]
bShowLODInEditor=0
fBlockLevel0Distance=35000.0000
fBlockLevel1Distance=70000.0000
fBlockMaximumDistance=250000.0000
fSplitDistanceMult=1.5000
fTreeLoadDistance=75000.0000
 
[Trees]
bRenderSkinnedTrees=1
uiMaxSkinnedTreesToRender=20
 
[Water]
bUseWaterDepth=1
bUseWaterDisplacements=1
bUseWaterReflections=1
bUseWaterRefractions=1
iWaterReflectHeight=512
iWaterReflectWidth=512

 

 

 

Below is some Skyrim Performance Monitor information:

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

 

Please let me know if there's any other useful information I can provide. This has been going on for over a month now, and the crash is frequent enough that, in spite of my game otherwise being almost perfectly stable and crash-free, the game is practically unplayable since I don't use fast travel and the area around Whiterun is my single most frequent destination on the map. As mentioned earlier, I have yet to see any particular cause/solution to this crash, and if this information (and subsequent information) can be of use in helping others resolve the issue, all the better.

Edited April 16, 2017 by A_Dim_Mismatch

[A_Dim_Mismatch]

An update on this subject:

 

With only one mod enabled (that being Alternate start, which was used for starting a quick game to test), otherwise only running the Skyrim master files and the high-res DLC, I'm still getting the crash. Any ideas? Anything ini-related, perhaps something that could be related to hardware settings on the GPU?

[Greg]

If you can reproduce it in a vanilla profile (with no other mods, meshes, or textures) and with a new game, I'd first use BethINI to establish a good set of INI files. If this doesn't solve the issue, use Steam to validate game cache to see if perhaps something is corrupt. If you've cleaned the game masters (Dawguard, Hearthfires, and Dragonborn), ensure the cleaned versions are unchecked so you use a pure vanilla game. Assuming this works (and I can't think of any reason it shouldn't), reactivate the cleaned versions of the vanilla mods to see if you can reproduce the issue and then start adding mods in small batches and keep testing until you find the culprit.

[A_Dim_Mismatch]

  On 4/23/2017 at 4:19 AM, Greg said:

If you can reproduce it in a vanilla profile (with no other mods, meshes, or textures) and with a new game, I'd first use BethINI to establish a good set of INI files. If this doesn't solve the issue, use Steam to validate game cache to see if perhaps something is corrupt. If you've cleaned the game masters (Dawguard, Hearthfires, and Dragonborn), ensure the cleaned versions are unchecked so you use a pure vanilla game. Assuming this works (and I can't think of any reason it shouldn't), reactivate the cleaned versions of the vanilla mods to see if you can reproduce the issue and then start adding mods in small batches and keep testing until you find the culprit.

Right, so here's some tests I've run via Mod Organizer (used Bethini accordingly):

-Original master files (not cleaned) + my total load order. Resulted in the same type of crash.

-Cleaned master files (not copies loaded separately in MO but the four .esm files that need to be cleaned) + my total load order. Resulted in the same type of crash.

-Original master files (not cleaned) with high-res DLC and no mods. Did not result in a crash after 90 minutes of riding around the vicinity of Whiterun on horseback. Looks like the base game is alright.

 

I've yet to load cleaned masters in Mod Organizer as mods--would that make a difference? Thus far I've just cleaned the original masters and used them in MO that way and didn't notice a difference in game stability.

[remlnx]

I know this is a very stupid question but.. Did you try to verify file cache on steam to let it check and replace any corrupted file? Also sometimes is just better totally remove and reinstall skyrim to start on a clean base

 

Inviato dal mio MHA-L09 utilizzando Tapatalk

[A_Dim_Mismatch]

  On 4/27/2017 at 9:33 AM, remlnx said:

I know this is a very stupid question but.. Did you try to verify file cache on steam to let it check and replace any corrupted file? Also sometimes is just better totally remove and reinstall skyrim to start on a clean base

 

Inviato dal mio MHA-L09 utilizzando Tapatalk

Indeed, I've verified and recently did a total reinstall. Reinstalled Skyrim, MO, LOOT, FNIS, SKSE, etc.

 

A couple other things I've noticed:

 

-The crash is extremely difficult to replicate while on foot (even moving at 5x normal running speed) but much easier to replicate on horseback (particularly when moving faster than normal)

-Since I reinstalled, the crash between Whiterun and Riverwood doesn't seem to happen anymore, but the game can sometimes crash in the area west of Whiterun (in the fields just west of the main gate, but east from any dungeons or map locations)

-The crash seems to occur around exterior cell transitions (especially between Chillfurrow Farm and the walls of Whiterun)

Edited April 27, 2017 by A_Dim_Mismatch

[remlnx]

So with no mods at all you have those cdt, clean simple skyrim?

 

Should not happen at all.

 

What I can suggest is that you Google "DirectX​ Redist June 2010" grab the Microsoft official link and install it (it's the most compatible directx for old Skyrim).

 

Also I know you already done it but no harm to suggest you to keep video drivers up to date and whitelist your skse and skyrim executables from your AV/Firewall.

 

I am really confused. Vanilla with no mods should be really stable

 

Inviato dal mio MHA-L09 utilizzando Tapatalk

Edited April 27, 2017 by remlnx

[A_Dim_Mismatch]

  On 4/27/2017 at 2:32 PM, remlnx said:

So with no mods at all you have those cdt, clean simple skyrim?

 

Should not happen at all.

 

What I can suggest is that you Google "DirectX​ Redist June 2010" grab the Microsoft official link and install it (it's the most compatible directx for old Skyrim).

 

Also I know you already done it but no harm to suggest you to keep video drivers up to date and whitelist your skse and skyrim executables from your AV/Firewall.

 

I am really confused. Vanilla with no mods should be really stable

 

Inviato dal mio MHA-L09 utilizzando Tapatalk

Vanilla with no mods is really stable, that's the thing. It's that adding mods - even a limited number of mods - doesn't play nicely with the game, and only in a very specific area on the in-game map. Outside of the vicinity of Whiterun, my load order doesn't give me any problems. And a crash can happen only 5 minutes in, or not happen after 60 minutes.

[remlnx]

I wonder if you are using any mod that alters Whiterun exteriors, like ETAC or similar. Also a grass mod can be the issue (im not telling you to play without, just try without and see what happens)

 

Anyway, I saw you using Crash Fixes.

Did you/can you try

 

set: UseOSAllocators=1

set: CustomMemoryBlock=1

set: CustomMemoryBlockTotalSizeMb=128 (or 192 if when you open the console you see a number above 70%)

 

Sound really like a memory issue to me but im not really an expert, im shooting in the dark, but since no one else is answering you, i try my best.

With the above settings i totally removed my random CDT's, before i had a very similar issue as you have but near Riverwood entrance.

[A_Dim_Mismatch]

  On 4/27/2017 at 10:08 PM, remlnx said:

I wonder if you are using any mod that alters Whiterun exteriors, like ETAC or similar. Also a grass mod can be the issue (im not telling you to play without, just try without and see what happens)

 

Anyway, I saw you using Crash Fixes.

Did you/can you try

 

set: UseOSAllocators=1

set: CustomMemoryBlock=1

set: CustomMemoryBlockTotalSizeMb=128 (or 192 if when you open the console you see a number above 70%)

 

Sound really like a memory issue to me but im not really an expert, im shooting in the dark, but since no one else is answering you, i try my best.

With the above settings i totally removed my random CDT's, before i had a very similar issue as you have but near Riverwood entrance.

I think it might be something memory-related too, because I tried a very light load order that occasionally resulted in the crash, then switched all of those mods out of the otherwise full load order and it didn't make a noticeable difference. Setting the custom memory block to 128 didn't solve the crash, but I'll run tests with higher settings and see what happens. Either way, I appreciate the help!

[Greg]

You should have the original, unmodified mods from the game in the Skyrim\Data folder and the cleaned versions installed as mods in Mod Organizer. I usually name mine something like "Cleaned Dragonborn" and keep them near of the top. This way if Steam decides it needs to update the game for some reason, your cleaned mods won't go up in smoke.

 

Now that you've established the base game itself is working reliably, install the cleaned versions in Mod Organizer as mods and enable them but without any other mods and try to reproduce the crash. If this is working nicely, enable small sets of mods (say 5 at a time) and repeat the test until you find the culprit. It can be time consuming and aggravating, but this is really the only way to determine which mod is causing the issue.

[A_Dim_Mismatch]

  On 4/28/2017 at 2:29 AM, Greg said:

You should have the original, unmodified mods from the game in the Skyrim\Data folder and the cleaned versions installed as mods in Mod Organizer. I usually name mine something like "Cleaned Dragonborn" and keep them near of the top. This way if Steam decides it needs to update the game for some reason, your cleaned mods won't go up in smoke.

 

Now that you've established the base game itself is working reliably, install the cleaned versions in Mod Organizer as mods and enable them but without any other mods and try to reproduce the crash. If this is working nicely, enable small sets of mods (say 5 at a time) and repeat the test until you find the culprit. It can be time consuming and aggravating, but this is really the only way to determine which mod is causing the issue.

How should I handle the cleaned masters in the load order? Put them in left pane immediately after each corresponding original master and likewise for the right pane? Should I disable the uncleaned masters in the right pane or keep them enabled as well?

[GrantSP]

@Greg's description of what to do pertains to the left pane of MO, not the right.

Once you activate the "Cleaned" versions in the left pane there will be ONLY one version of each DLC in the right. Therefore your question on disabling them is moot.

[TechAngel85]

What Windows version are you running so that we know the memory limits you're under?

 

Honestly, this doesn't sound like a memory issue, else you'd be experience it in other areas of the game. It sounds more like a corrupt mesh. That's just my hunch.

[A_Dim_Mismatch]

  On 4/28/2017 at 2:43 AM, GrantSP said:

@Greg's description of what to do pertains to the left pane of MO, not the right.

Once you activate the "Cleaned" versions in the left pane there will be ONLY one version of each DLC in the right. Therefore your question on disabling them is moot.

Alright, I'll run some tests as such. Running it that way with a complete load order doesn't appear to work, but that doesn't mean I can't test it otherwise.

 

  On 4/28/2017 at 4:22 AM, TechAngel85 said:

What Windows version are you running so that we know the memory limits you're under?

 

Honestly, this doesn't sound like a memory issue, else you'd be experience it in other areas of the game. It sounds more like a corrupt mesh. That's just my hunch.

Windows 7.

 

If it's of any use, here's a screenshot of a load order I ran which did not work; this used the original Skyrim masters (not cleaned):

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Not pictured (left pane only) are Realvision 279b, the Realvision 279b Particle Patch and the Realvision 279b Subsurface Patch, along with Alternate Start. Otherwise this screenshot contains the only that mods I used.

 

 

 

What's curious about this is that I excluded these mods in other tests (ran a test without SKSE and any mods which depended on it; ran a test without Realvision ENB; a test without FNIS, a test without USLEEP and the high-res patch, etc.) but even that didn't change the outcome of the crash problem. It becomes more difficult to replicate the crash the fewer mods that I use, but excluding anything in particular does not seem to suddenly fix it.

[TechAngel85]

Have you opened up xEdit to look for conflicts?

 

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