VRAM - How do you not run out?

[skyrimnub]

Howdy. I'm not sure how ya'll do it.  I have 1GB of VRAM on a native 2560x1600 monitor.  If I start a new game with STEP through 2.E "Interface", my VRAM shoots to 1021MB instantly.  If I drop the resolution down to 1920x1200, it is at 890MB.  Pretty much anything I add after that sends it to 1021MB.  How do the 1GB folk not run out of memory?

 

I've installed all the Core modules and started at 1920x1200, 60FPS mostly unless I spin around then it dips into the 40s, sometimes it'll hiccup as it's swapping textures.  Usually not.

 

Sometimes I get red/green triangles flashing all crazy if I face a certain direction but goes away if I reload the game.  Not sure what that's about; I'll probably try to capture a picture or video at some point.

[JudgmentJay]

1GB of VRAM is not enough for 2560x1600. Resolution plays a huge role in how much VRAM you need.

[TechAngel85]

Howdy. I'm not sure how ya'll do it.  I have 1GB of VRAM on a native 2560x1600 monitor.  If I start a new game with STEP through 2.E "Interface", my VRAM shoots to 1021MB instantly.  If I drop the resolution down to 1920x1200, it is at 890MB.  Pretty much anything I add after that sends it to 1021MB.  How do the 1GB folk not run out of memory?

 

I've installed all the Core modules and started at 1920x1200, 60FPS mostly unless I spin around then it dips into the 40s, sometimes it'll hiccup as it's swapping textures.  Usually not.

 

Sometimes I get red/green triangles flashing all crazy if I face a certain direction but goes away if I reload the game.  Not sure what that's about; I'll probably try to capture a picture or video at some point.

 By not running at insanely high resolutions. :P Check the Hardware Guide (video card section on that page) for a quick look on how screen resolution affects performance.

 

You'll need nothing less than (to run at 2560x1600 resolution):

AMD Radeon HD 7870 2GB

nVidia GeForce GTX 670 2GB

 

I run at 1366x768 on my laptop with a GTX 460M, never use texture resolutions over 2048x, and always opt for the 1024x resolutions if they are available so to better manage my 1GB VRAM.

[skyrimnub]

Yes, but I thought 1920x1200 was a "sane" compromise, and it was still 900MB :P. I'll head over to the Hardware Guide you referenced.

 

I did note that the running a full Core STEP was challenging at 2560x1600 with all the hiccups.

 

I'm curious, does your VRAM usage exceed 1GB? Like I said, at 1920x1200, mine does, but it's very playable as I get high framerates and /rare/ stuttering. I just don't see adding many more of the STEP mods beyond Core at this point, though.

[TechAngel85]

Mine stays steady at around 1018MB with a full STEP installation and I rarely experience any stutter while gaming. Like I said, texture resolutions are going to be your make or break with a full STEP install on 1GB VRAM. I would say with 1GB you would be be hard pressed to run a full STEP installation over 1600x900 (and it's 4:3 equivalent).

[Besidilo]

Howdy. I'm not sure how ya'll do it.  I have 1GB of VRAM on a native 2560x1600 monitor.  If I start a new game with STEP through 2.E "Interface", my VRAM shoots to 1021MB instantly.  If I drop the resolution down to 1920x1200, it is at 890MB.  Pretty much anything I add after that sends it to 1021MB.  How do the 1GB folk not run out of memory?

 

I've installed all the Core modules and started at 1920x1200, 60FPS mostly unless I spin around then it dips into the 40s, sometimes it'll hiccup as it's swapping textures.  Usually not.

 

Sometimes I get red/green triangles flashing all crazy if I face a certain direction but goes away if I reload the game.  Not sure what that's about; I'll probably try to capture a picture or video at some point.

 By not running at insanely high resolutions. :P Check the Hardware Guide (video card section on that page) for a quick look on how screen resolution affects performance.

 

You'll need nothing less than (to run at 2560x1600 resolution):

AMD Radeon HD 7870 2GB

nVidia GeForce GTX 670 2GB

 

I run at 1366x768 on my laptop with a GTX 460M, never use texture resolutions over 2048x, and always opt for the 1024x resolutions if they are available so to better manage my 1GB VRAM.

This is incorrect, I had been running full STEP with ENB on GTX 580 1.5GB at 2560x1440 before, without any major issues.

 

It's possible to get full STEP running at this resolution on a card with 1.25GB, but some sacrifices would have to be made and tweaks done to keep the VRAM usage on the leash.

 

I suggest the following:

 

a) running lite versions of texture mods (1024x or below), no exceptions

b) optimising all large textures with DDSopt

c) making sure that there's enough swap memory to avoid potential crashes

d) INI tweaking to make sure that RAM is assigned correctly

e) launching Skyrim with ATTK Loader (or doing the tweaks manually, if you can be bothered)

f) dropping any form of anti-aliasing completely, resorting to light FXAA or SMAA

g) running the game at 2560x1440 instead, with bars on top/bottom (not stretched, instead using 1:1 pixel mapping)

h) getting rid of the ENB and minimising post-processing packs

i) disabling Windows Aero/Desktop Composition, and any unnecessary background processes

j) overclocking the GPU memory (it will increase the memory bandwidth on the card) and core (faster rendering)

k) dropping memory intensive STEP mods in case the following don't help, I suggest starting with Vanilla Skyrim + fixes and working your way up from there

l) enabling HiAlgoBoost

 

And please stop quoting how much VRAM your game uses or even requires, because it's not possible to measure accurately, as has been discussed a number of times on this and other forums.

 

Besides, if you have $1200 to spend on a monitor, I'm sure you'd be able to invest $200-300 in a decent graphics card and highly recommend that you do if you're serious about PC gaming.

 

I recommend Radeon 7850 2GB for $200 ish and Radeon 7950 3GB for $300 ish.

[z929669]

I suggest the following:

 

a) running lite versions of texture mods (1024x or below), no exceptions

b) optimising all large textures with DDSopt

c) making sure that there's enough swap memory to avoid potential crashes

d) INI tweaking to make sure that RAM is assigned correctly

Examples?

e) launching Skyrim with ATTK Loader (or doing the tweaks manually, if you can be bothered)

f) dropping any form of anti-aliasing completely, resorting to light FXAA or SMAA

g) running the game at 2560x1440 instead, with bars on top/bottom (not stretched, instead using 1:1 pixel mapping)

h) getting rid of the ENB and minimising post-processing packs

This won't impact VRAM, so I would not trim PP unless FPS is a real issue

i) disabling Windows Aero/Desktop Composition, and any unnecessary background processes

Isn't this redundant with ATTK?

j) overclocking the GPU memory (it will increase the memory bandwidth on the card) and core (faster rendering)

k) dropping memory intensive STEP mods in case the following don't help, I suggest starting with Vanilla Skyrim + fixes and working your way up from there

l) enabling HiAlgoBoost

 

And please stop quoting how much VRAM your game uses or even requires, because it's not possible to measure accurately, as has been discussed a number of times on this and other forums.

Actually, you can get a pretty accurate measure with GPU-z by getting a baseline for windows first ans subtracting this from Dedicated/Dynamic values when running Skyrim ... or you can use Sysinternals' Process Explorer utility, which breaks down dedicated/system VRAM allocation by process.

Besides, if you have $1200 to spend on a monitor, I'm sure you'd be able to invest $200-300 in a decent graphics card and highly recommend that you do if you're serious about PC gaming.

 

I recommend Radeon 7850 2GB for $200 ish and Radeon 7950 3GB for $300 ish.

I agree that this user should be able to run at high res, but I strongly recommend capping at 1920x1200 for a 1 GB card and running Baseline STEP with 1k-capped textures for all clutter and many world textures (interiors and dungeons can be 2-4k though)

[z929669]

Howdy. I'm not sure how ya'll do it.  I have 1GB of VRAM on a native 2560x1600 monitor.  If I start a new game with STEP through 2.E "Interface", my VRAM shoots to 1021MB instantly.  If I drop the resolution down to 1920x1200, it is at 890MB.  Pretty much anything I add after that sends it to 1021MB.  How do the 1GB folk not run out of memory?

 

I've installed all the Core modules and started at 1920x1200, 60FPS mostly unless I spin around then it dips into the 40s, sometimes it'll hiccup as it's swapping textures.  Usually not.

 

Sometimes I get red/green triangles flashing all crazy if I face a certain direction but goes away if I reload the game.  Not sure what that's about; I'll probably try to capture a picture or video at some point.

What is the GPU and what are you using to measure VRAM? What is your method for assessing VRAM?

[Besidilo]

Examples?

I can't remember any specific ones, but I'm sure Nvidia's Tweak Guide will mention some.

This won't impact VRAM, so I would not trim PP unless FPS is a real issue

Umm, yes it may. IIRC, both RCRN and RLWC increased my VRAM usage, however little it may be. Whilst the impact won't be the same as with running high resolution textures, I strongly suggest to use a trial and error method when testing out the more memory intensive mods. This is just a suggestion anyway.

Isn't this redundant with ATTK?

It is, but that's assuming that he's going to use ATTK. Otherwise, there are some specific tweaks to the system he can make himself to make sure the initial load is reduced to minimum. Windows Aero has a significant VRAM impact in this case.

 

Actually, you can get a pretty accurate measure with GPU-z by getting a baseline for windows first ans subtracting this from Dedicated/Dynamic values when running Skyrim ... or you can use Sysinternals' Process Explorer utility, which breaks down dedicated/system VRAM allocation by process.

Last time I checked, measuring dynamic VRAM usage was less than reliable using above methods, but I will do the testing myself to see how accurate it is. It's easy for me since I'm running on the edge of VRAM limitation anyway.

I agree that this user should be able to run at high res, but I strongly recommend capping at 1920x1200 for a 1 GB card and running Baseline STEP with 1k-capped textures for all clutter and many world textures (interiors and dungeons can be 2-4k though)

Stretched resolution looks ugly on LCD screens, especially those without a proper scaler. Either way, he's much better off tweaking his Skyrim install to run it at 2560x1440 than dropping to 1920x1200 until he gets a new graphics card.

 

EDIT: Breaking down quotes on this forum is retarded.

[skyrimnub]

I have SLI EVGA nVidia 460 GTX 1GB OC 763 MHz. I measure VRAM w/ GPU-Z and Precision-X, both reporting the same results. Both cards are running at 164 MB right now while not running any games/videos/etc. The cards are 2.5 years old, but I want to make it through the summer with them before doing my 3-yr upgrade. :)

 

As for resolution choices, I don't have a lot of options. The two between 2560x1600 and 1920x1200 are 4:3, which I don't want to do. Manually setting it to 2560x1440 in Skyrim does what one expect--it errors saying the resolution isn't supported by the monitor.

 

My FPS isn't a problem, it's the typical stutter that happens. I think I under-estimated how often it was stuttering from swapping textures from RAM to VRAM. It has improved since I made some changes (see below).

 

I turned off Aero and with a few, lower resolution STEP packages, was able to get it around 980-1010 outside of Solitude. The intro sequence, which was at 1018 is now at 890 or so. Specifically, I went with:

 

HDDLC Optimized 1024 All

SMIM manual configuration and chose half-textures on the final option

Enhanced Distant Terrain 512

High Quality LODs 1024

Real Ice 1024

Disabled Trees HD (using SRO 1.74d)

 

I have yet to DDSopt. I'll see if I can figure out how to do that properly.

 

In doing this, it made me think that it would be helpful if in the STEP guide, there was a "biggest bang for your buck" when disabling or lowering resolution on the mods. Like with SMIM, was it worth going half-textures? Would it have been better to do something else, first?

 

I do get this now and again.  In this case, it's the vertical plane of the sawblade in a mill.  If I turn to where the sawblade isn't in my FOV, it goes away. I walked around and flipped the lever making the blade move and it went away.  Most recently, I saw it in Solitude.  Leaving and returning / reloading / etc. makes it go away; in other words, it's not repeatable.  Typically, what does this point to as a problem?

 

 

Cheers and thanks.

[TechAngel85]

I have SLI EVGA nVidia 460 GTX 1GB OC 763 MHz. I measure VRAM w/ GPU-Z and Precision-X, both reporting the same results. Both cards are running at 164 MB right now while not running any games/videos/etc. The cards are 2.5 years old, but I want to make it through the summer with them before doing my 3-yr upgrade. :)

You card is fairly equivalent to mine.

As for resolution choices, I don't have a lot of options. The two between 2560x1600 and 1920x1200 are 4:3, which I don't want to do. Manually setting it to 2560x1440 in Skyrim does what one expect--it errors saying the resolution isn't supported by the monitor.

This is what i expected after reading Besidilo's post on that. He's rather spirited in it come to hardware. Him and I disagree a lot on the subject. Z, is right in this case. Use a lower resolution. 1920x1080 is widescreen. Use the closest widescreen format you can get to that, but don't go higher.

My FPS isn't a problem, it's the typical stutter that happens. I think I under-estimated how often it was stuttering from swapping textures from RAM to VRAM. It has improved since I made some changes (see below).

I agree with Z here, your post-processors aren't an issue with VRAM. There's no need to turn them off. They don't effect my VRAM any, only FPS. Though, it might not be ideal, lowering your AA could help. I only use the RCRN FXAA. SMAA is a better option though if you have to do that.

I have yet to DDSopt. I'll see if I can figure out how to do that properly.

Using DDSopt can really help out a lot. Capping your texture resolutions, as I've been saying, is going to make the biggest difference. Never use anything over 2048x and always use 1024x when available. You can even use 512x on the smaller clutter objects (pots, dishes, ingredients, etc).

Typically, what does this point to as a problem?

Not repeatable? Interesting... Are you overclocking?

 

PS:

There is no INI tweak to control memory. I've never heard of this....it's not in the GeForce guides.

[skyrimnub]

Thanks again.

 

And yes, actually, I am overclocking. One of those things I set 2.5 years ago and didn't consider since it's been stable. I will experiment with that. I haven't seen this before, but I've never pushed the cards to their capacity.

 

DDSopt is almost done. Took a couple of hours for everything. We'll see if I did it right. BTW, the screens on the Wiki article for DDSopt are inaccurate for the latest version.

[Besidilo]

You card is fairly equivalent to mine.

Not even close, he's got two overclocked desktop GTX 460s, you have a mobile version of the card, which is pretty much in the same tier as the desktop GTS 450.

 

https://www.anandtech.com/show/4363/nvidia-geforce-gtx-560m-highend-mobile-graphics-with-optimus

https://www.tomshardware.co.uk/gaming-graphics-card-review,review-32586-7.html

 

This is what i expected after reading Besidilo's post on that. He's rather spirited in it come to hardware. Him and I disagree a lot on the subject. Z, is right in this case. Use a lower resolution. 1920x1080 is widescreen. Use the closest widescreen format you can get to that, but don't go higher.

You can disagree all you want, but using a full screen resolution with proper pixel mapping is the only way to ensure quality of the picture. Otherwise the whole thing will be stretched out, worsening as far as the monitor's scaler abilities go. 2560x1440 with black bars would work, all you need to do is enable 1:1 pixel mapping in the drivers or monitor's settings, which is a piece of cake, really.

 

I agree with Z here, your post-processors aren't an issue with VRAM. There's no need to turn them off. They don't effect my VRAM any, only FPS. Though, it might not be ideal, lowering your AA could help. I only use the RCRN FXAA. SMAA is a better option though if you have to do that.

But they do. You're assuming that the post-processing mods I had in mind only do post-processing. It's easy to prove and I don't mind doing so as soon as I get to reinstalling Skyrim this weekend.

 

There is no INI tweak to control memory. I've never heard of this....it's not in the GeForce guides. 

I'm pretty sure there were, albeit they might be from another guide. I will try and dig them out, although the results might be less than noticeable, so I don't know if they make any performance difference whatsoever.

 

EDIT as for that screenshot, it could be a driver issue, I recommend reinstalling the 310.90 or 306.97 (which is someone more stable in Skyrim) from scratch.

[z929669]

I have SLI EVGA nVidia 460 GTX 1GB OC 763 MHz. I measure VRAM w/ GPU-Z and Precision-X, both reporting the same results. Both cards are running at 164 MB right now while not running any games/videos/etc. The cards are 2.5 years old, but I want to make it through the summer with them before doing my 3-yr upgrade. :)

 

As for resolution choices, I don't have a lot of options. The two between 2560x1600 and 1920x1200 are 4:3, which I don't want to do. Manually setting it to 2560x1440 in Skyrim does what one expect--it errors saying the resolution isn't supported by the monitor.

 

My FPS isn't a problem, it's the typical stutter that happens. I think I under-estimated how often it was stuttering from swapping textures from RAM to VRAM. It has improved since I made some changes (see below).

 

I turned off Aero and with a few, lower resolution STEP packages, was able to get it around 980-1010 outside of Solitude. The intro sequence, which was at 1018 is now at 890 or so. Specifically, I went with:

 

HDDLC Optimized 1024 All

SMIM manual configuration and chose half-textures on the final option

Enhanced Distant Terrain 512

High Quality LODs 1024

Real Ice 1024

Disabled Trees HD (using SRO 1.74d)

 

I have yet to DDSopt. I'll see if I can figure out how to do that properly.

 

In doing this, it made me think that it would be helpful if in the STEP guide, there was a "biggest bang for your buck" when disabling or lowering resolution on the mods. Like with SMIM, was it worth going half-textures? Would it have been better to do something else, first?

 

I do get this now and again.  In this case, it's the vertical plane of the sawblade in a mill.  If I turn to where the sawblade isn't in my FOV, it goes away. I walked around and flipped the lever making the blade move and it went away.  Most recently, I saw it in Solitude.  Leaving and returning / reloading / etc. makes it go away; in other words, it's not repeatable.  Typically, what does this point to as a problem?

 

 

Cheers and thanks.

RE your VRAM, GPU-z reports 2x VRAM when in SLI or CrossfireX (see Performance section of the DDSopt Guide on the wiki). This means that you will not begin to see lag until GPU-z reaches soumething more than double your actual VRAM (for some reason, the software adds the memory of both cards even though the GPU memory is mirrored).

 

For the clipping issue, lower your:fNearDistance=18.0000

[skyrimnub]

RE: Drivers. I have been running 306.97. I've found this to be the best across multiple games. I'll check out 310.90.

RE: Resolution. My native resolution 2560x1600 is 16:10 ratio, as is 1920x1200, which is what I'm running now to reduce stutter.

RE: GPU-z. The version I have is not reporting 2x. There's a drop-down at the bottom to switch between the two cards. Toggling between the two shows exactly what Precision-X is showing, which shows graphs of both side-by-side. To wit, at 2560x1600 with all recommended Core mod texture resolutions, it remained steady 1017. At 1920x1200 resolution, it also remained steady at 1017 MB.

RE: fNearDistance. It is already 18.000 as per the STEP INI guidance.

[Besidilo]

RE: Drivers. I have been running 306.97. I've found this to be the best across multiple games. I'll check out 310.90.

RE: Resolution. My native resolution 2560x1600 is 16:10 ratio, as is 1920x1200, which is what I'm running now to reduce stutter.

Trying out 2560x1440 is up to you, but I think it's the best choice to reduce the load a little while retaining the high image quality.

 

RE: GPU-z. The version I have is not reporting 2x. There's a drop-down at the bottom to switch between the two cards. Toggling between the two shows exactly what Precision-X is showing, which shows graphs of both side-by-side. To wit, at 2560x1600 with all recommended Core mod texture resolutions, it remained steady 1017. At 1920x1200 resolution, it also remained steady at 1017 MB.

That's because you can't measure what game is buffering on demand, which is why software measurements are inaccurate the closer you get to the VRAM limit.