Frequent CTDs

[Octopuss]

Reader beware. There is a lot of misinformation on this thread, so please read the closing post before continuing.

 

This thread is a great source for instructing novice modders as to how difficult and tedious it can be to create a custom modded setup.

STEP

 

---

Even with 4GB card and ENBoost, I am crashing like no tomorrow with this game. Like someone pointed out in other thread, it's probably not related to memory problems (I've just CTDed after fast travelling) but rather mods incompatibility or something like that.

I currently do not use higher ugrids (with all the mods I have, I could run with 9 without any apparent problems in the previous game). I have SKSE 1.7 alpha installed and use the memory patch settings.

Does anyone see anything horribly wrong with my load order (it's 99% done by BOSS, I only switched Realistic Weapons positions after DSR patch as suggested on Nexus)?

[Kuldebar]

It's just some random mod problem I can't really troubleshoot. I guess I will live with it, it's playable enough.

Octo, stop saying that!

First off, it may appear "random" but I can assure you it has a definable cause that you currently are not aware of...yes, that's the hard part. (like my recent Hert NPC Vampire Face BUG)

If you wanna live with it fine, I respect that, but the issue could be sorted out, perhaps at the cost of getting rid of a mod or mods in your load order. This is on the assumption that you have no memory usage issues.

[Octopuss]

I can't troubleshoot something that happens randomly one to three times in roughly five hours!

I also can't imagine starting a new game and playing for say two hours, add a mod, play in the same way (ideally) for two more hours, and repeat this 50 times. That's impossible! I'd go crazy and would probably end up uninstalling the game

[MadWizard25]

Its a personal choice. Depends on how frequent the CTDs are. If its every few hours then thats fine imo.

 

Octopuss, you could also test out groups of mods in the beginning, and then do vurts stress test to test it these groups. You only need 10 minutes for the test, especially if you use Alternative Start Live another life mod. 

[Octopuss]

Ah that's a good idea. Especially the Alternate Start one. I didn't get to activate it yet, and it can obviously come handy.

[Octopuss]

Haha flying around the map is really fun
So I started testing.
First of all, my mods are based on STEP with the same groups - I just add extra mods in, and also keep my the list in an Excel sheet with notes (it's also happens to be a quick reference guide for installation order in case something gets messed up).
 
I started activating groups one by one, flying around the map for up to five minutes. I got almost at the bottom of my modlist. During the time the game CTD'ed about 3 times (I should have written it down).
 
I also got a few CTDs when I started a new game (as in, after clicking New game in the main menu), which I didn't think much of at first, but then it got me thinking: if the game CAN (not that it always or often does, but just the obvious chance of it happening) crash at that point, something could be really wrong.
 
So,
ROUND ONE
After some thinking, I did the following:
- downgraded Catalyst from 14.3 beta to the latest official WHQL 13.12
- switched to default Skyrim inis (actually I think I did it before I started doing any testing, but not sure)
 
Then I came up with the following methodology to test this particular problem first:
Activate a group of mods, and start a new game 10 times:

- if it doesn't crash, extend it to 25 times

- if it crashes after 10th and before 25th, consider the possibility of random error not caused by mods, but keep testing

- if it crashes before 10th, then do not try further, and:

• remove last of my extra mods from the list and start a new game 25 times
• if it still crashes, remove the next mod and try again until I can start a game 25 times
• if it doesn't crash, mark the offender and move down to next group of mods

This is going to take some time...

Edited March 26, 2014 by Octopuss

[MadWizard25]

I feel you man, testing out a large mod setup takes forever. Thankfully MO, Alternative Start, Vurt's Stress Test, and mod groups make the testing much more bearable. Still takes time, but days instead of weeks :)

 

Nice catch with the default inis as well, its a very good point.

 

Good luck and hope you find those CTD issues solvable!

Edited March 26, 2014 by MadWizard25

[Octopuss]

First offender found!

Surprisingly, it's A Matter of Time - A HUD clock widget. The interesting fact is the mod itself is not malfunctioning, but when used with SkyUI, the CTDs start. Something tells me it's not only related to new games, but loading games in general, which would explain the occasional random CTDs when quickloading.

[MadWizard25]

Oh, well, in that case i think ill uninstall it as well    Thanks!

[Octopuss]

I don't think there's any reason for you to do that if you don't suffer from CTDs, all I am saying is what it does to my game.

[MadWizard25]

True, but I have such a large number of plugins and mods that Im aggressively culling everything remotely fishy at the moment, and thats even before testing.

[Kuldebar]

I use A Matter of Time but like one of the earlier versions ( v1.3 )before the Mod Author went insane and started adding complicated stuff. I don't have any probs with it...I change the scale of the current time and icon, use the dial icon and move to left bottom of screen.

 

Not to brag, or jinx myself, but I have been CTD free for real-time 7+ days of heavy Skyrim.

SSME, ENBoost with Grim & Somber Preset:

 

Skyrim.esmUpdate.esmUnofficial Skyrim Patch.espDawnguard.esmUnofficial Dawnguard Patch.espHearthFires.esmUnofficial Hearthfire Patch.espDragonborn.esmUnofficial Dragonborn Patch.espApachiiHair.esmApachiiHairFemales.esmApachiiHairMales.esmETaC - RESOURCES.esmLanterns Of Skyrim - All In One - Main.esmSPERG.esmTravellersOfSkyrim.esmXFLMain.esmREGS - Resources.esmHighResTexturePack01.espHighResTexturePack02.espHighResTexturePack03.espHousecarl Greetings Fix.espRelightingSkyrim.espRelighting Skyrim - Update.espRelighting Skyrim - Dawnguard.espRelighting Skyrim - HearthFire.espRelighting Skyrim - Dragonborn.espUnofficial High Resolution Patch.espWeapons & Armor Fixes_Remade.espClothing & Clutter Fixes.espRainbows.espBardSoundsMalukah.espImmersive Sounds - Magic.espImproved Combat Sounds v2.2.espSkyrim - Player Re-Voiced - Elven Races Complete - Male.espStaticMeshImprovementMod-DragonbornTernFix.espStaticMeshImprovementMod-FurnitureChestSnowFix.espTradeBarter.espAMatterOfTime.espAuto Unequip Helmet.espBellyachesNewDragonSpecies.espCraftable and Placeable Havok-enabled Bedrolls .espDragonBlood.espEpisodeParallax.espHARODATH_ImmersiveSoulgems.espHoldBorderBanners.espImmersive Battles.espImmersive Brigands.espImmersive Dawnguard.espImmersive Dragonborn.espImmersive Factions.espImmersive Mercenaries.espImmersive Patrols.espImmersive Travelers.espImmersive Werewolves.espLanterns Of Skyrim - All In One - Somber ENB.espLanterns Of Skyrim - AIO - Dawnguard.espmcCampingLite.espPoint The Way.espPopulated Dungeons Caves Ruins.espPopulated Forts Towers Places.espPopulated Lands Roads Paths.espprostitutes.espShootingStars.espWoollyRhino.espSkyrim Immersive Creatures.espSkyrim Immersive Creatures - DLC2.espSmoking Torches.espSwiftPotion.espSurilie And Argonian Wine.espimmersive wenches.espTelvanniGuards.espTravellersOfSkyrim - Vanilla.espTravellersOfSkyrim - Dragonborn Addon.espRaceMenu.espKJ Tattoos.espSkyUI.espSaveHotKeyMCM.espDreamBurrowsRegalHuntsmanArmor.espmage_clothes_plus.espenchantedclothing.espHothtrooper44_Armor_Ecksstra.espHothtrooper44_ArmorCompilation.espImmersive Weapons.espMageStarterKit.espDawnguard Starter Pack.espForestAtronach.espTwohanded Dawnbreaker.espSunburst Dawnbreaker.espAuroraVillage.espGildergreen Regrown.esphigh hrothgar overhaul.espInconsequential NPCs.espInns and Taverns.espLightsLakeviewManor.espRiversideLodge.espSleepTight.espRun For Your Lives.espSky Haven Temple M&M3.espSnowbound Acres.espThe Paarthurnax Dilemma.espThistleCottage.espForgotten Windmill.espWindhelm Lighthouse.espGuard Dialogue Overhaul.espGuardAnimationsGDO.espWeaponsArmorFixes_GuardDialogueOverhaul_Patch.espNPC_Overhaul_V_1_.espUSKP_NPCoverhaul_Patch.espAnruin - Faendal Replacer.espAuleric_Nord_Mage_Follower.espAzener.espBattle Buddy Jon Battle-Born for NPC Overhaul.espBattle Buddy Delacourt for NPC Overhaul.espBrothers.espDelphine Makeover D2.espFarvis.espJulienTheWise.espKaiden.espMarcurioGB.espOnmund by CrimsonFairy.espRavishingRedheadsFancy.espSRIsaka.espSRSarasta.espTalvas by CrimsonFairy.espThorald GreyMane.espConvenient Horses.espTravelMounts.espTrueGauldurAmulet.espUnreadBooksGlow.espWeapons & Armor_DragonPriestMasks.espSkyFalls + SkyMills + DG + DB.espSkyFalls Dragonborn Small waterfalls.espWinterhold College Mage Student Dorm Improvements.espsm_winterholdgate.espClosedBorderGates.espETaC - Complete.espETaC - Complete LoS Patch.espETaC - Dragon Bridge South.espDawnofRiften.espWhiterunAlivePiano.espExpandedWinterholdRuinsExterior.espHearthfireChimneys - ETaC.espREGS - Better City Entrances.espREGS - Better Docks.espOblivion Gates v3 - Skyrim + Dawnguard DLC.espPrometheus_No_snow_Under_the_roof.espDawnofWindhelm.espPopulated Cities Towns Villages.espProvincial Courier Service.espREGS - Cities.espREGS Patch - NSutR.espDerrax_Male_Werewolf_HUMANpenis.espLeazersOpenLock2_0.espBetter Stealth AI for Followers.espSPERG.espSPERG-DG.espSPERG-DB.espSPERG Immersive Armors.espSPERG Weapons and Armor Complete.espBeards.espBrows.espFlansEyesForSkrim.espTheEyesOfBeauty.espThe Eyes Of Beauty - Elves Edition.espPresets 2-3.espXFLDialogue.espXFLPlugins.espSPERG Extensible Follower Framework.espNonEssentialChildren.espiNeed.espTTYM - Think to Yourself Messages.espNo More Glowing Edges.espWATER.espWATER Plants.espWATER DG.espWATER DB Waves.espBashed Patch, 0.esp

 

[Octopuss]

ROUND TWO

I got pretty confident I nailed the load CTDs, so I jumped back onto the airplane. I got through 2 or so groups of mods until I CTD'ed after activating characters and creatures. The trouble is I cannot get the damn game to crash again. I started a new game and started flying around like mad, stopping in seemingly "complicated" areas with lots of stuff to load (like, forts and other large structures, ideally with several characters moving around), and nothing. It's been weel over 5 minutes and it's stable as rock. Shall I move on, attributing the crash to some random factor?

Edited March 26, 2014 by Octopuss

[MadWizard25]

Did you try reproduce it by deactivating and activating characters and creatures again, after flying around for several minutes? You could also go through each mod in that group and test, or try smaller groups and try test the functionality of each. Try ToggleAI command and showracemenu, those are good for testing char and creatures in general. You could also try spawn NPCs and see how far you get, its another stress test but more for NPCs. You can also test timescale and weather stability by increasing the timescale to 1000 and then 10000 while flying around

Edited March 26, 2014 by MadWizard25

[Octopuss]

What happaned was I simply activated another group of mods, started the game, started running around, and crashed in roughly one minute. Then I simply started the game again and tried to crash it again. It's been like 10 minutes now and it's still fine. I swear I sprinted through the entire game world at least 3 times. It just wouldn't crash again.

I also tried timescale of 10000, and except for things getting a tiny bit laggier, nothing happened.

Ha! After some 5 more minutes, finally a crash! But it took awfully long, like 15-20 minutes. According to vurt, CTDs are "supposed" to happen within a minute or so when testing this way.

This is going to suck to test properly

Edited March 26, 2014 by Octopuss

[MadWizard25]

The threshold for vurts test is 5 minutes. If you can achieve that regularly, especially with such a fast timescale, you are actually in a good position to play. You may still get ctds when playing but they should be minimal in number. Several hours of gameplay with no ctd is fine imo. Your probably never going to achieve an un-crashable modded skyrim, so at some point it needs to be 'good enough' to play. I would say your getting close, especially if you can achieve 10 minutes. Also, be sure to fly as close to the ground as possible, to force object loading. If you are too high up you load the cells but not full gfx. You want to stress the system.

 

If you can get 5 minutes on average after all groups installed, then thats great. Once you have done that, try some large amounts of NPC spawning, somewhere tough like riverwood exterior, and see how high you can get. Any more than 30 is fine, and you should be able to get higher than that. After that, try a rough playthrough for a couple hours :) If thats all good I would start.

 

Edit: you can also bump up the ugrids to really stress your system, and to see if you may be able to play with it at an increased value.

Edited March 26, 2014 by MadWizard25