Having trouble getting correct textures in LOD...

[VanGohman]

I am really new to this (and by "new" I mean I've been trying to figure this out for 3 years now).

I'm trying to get all of this to work with Skyrim VR using Mod Manager 2 (portable mode).

I believe I have gotten DynDOLOD to "work" partially, in that I managed to get the lod for Azura's statue to match the "Sexy Statues" version I have installed by including a rule at the bottom of the rules list.

This seems to show up in game just fine.

I think the tree lods have worked for my "3d Trees and Plants", "3d Landscapes", and "Trees Addon SSE" (plus it's cities trees beta), and all seem to be visible in the lod.

I also believe that I'm seeing the improved LODS for objects such as houses, because I can now see lod for things like Elysium Estate, which adds a player home just outside of Whiterun, because I now see this player home much sooner than I would have without using DynDOLOD.

But for some reason, the LOD textures for all homes all seem to look like "vanilla" textures, while I'm using a combination of "Skyrim Realistic Overhaul" textures with "Noble Skyrim" set to overwrite the former, and then "Majestic Mountains" (including the "complimentary textures" and it's own "Lod pack for Dyndolod" set to overwrite both.

When I'm close to Honningbrew Meadery, it has the darker textures that come with Noble Skyrim (I think), which includes additional arch detail on the left building over the door, but as I walk backwards over the bridge that takes me along the whiterun wall it eventually switches to what look like vanilla textures.

The other issue I'm wondering about is I have a mod called "Immersive Fallen Trees" that adds "Fallen Trees" all over the place, many spanning rivers etc. And I don't see the tree models it adds in the lod, at least not very far off lod. There is one tree in particular I've been testing with, and it appears on the river just above the bridge you go to with the console command coc Whiterun.

Does DynDOLOD create additional lod models for terrain object modes like "Immersive Fallen Trees"? If so, how far would I be able to see them?

I've been resisting the urge to post here for weeks now, pouring over the manuals, additional information, guides, and tutorial videos, so if this is a simple thing, I apologize in advance.

Thanks for taking the time to read this and if you can help, even more thanks in advance!

-VanGohman

 

Edited August 29, 2020 by VanGohman

[VanGohman]

Whoops, I meant to say Mod Organizer 2, not Mod Manager 2.

[sheson]

Don't be worried about asking. I only mention/copy relevant existing documentation so I do not have to type everything out all the time.
 
As is mentioned in DynDOLOD_TexGen.html, not all object LOD texture can be automatically updated.
 
This is a bit experimental and doesn't work for pre-rendered textures like the town LOD textures, distant mountain peaks or glaciers for example. Having a look at the object LOD source textures like textures\lod\wrbuildingslod01.dds for town buildings and comparing them to tileable landscape textures makes it clear. The town LOD textures are rendered from the full models and not a simple derivative of a full texture. They were then processed with an image program to create the final LOD textures.
 
If a mod changes the full textures it should also update the pre-rendered object LOD textures. See this thread for more discussion about the topic.
 
HD LODs Textures SE has updated pre-rendered object LOD for Noble Skyrim. I am not aware about specific updated object LOD textures for Skyrim Realistic Overhaul. If you mix mods changing different parts of a building then manually updating pre-rendered object LOD textures because a real pain, since a render of a side view of a building might contain many different textures from many different mods. 
 
There is terrain, the ground that is walked on. It is based on a height map. Terrain LOD meshes are generated from the heightmaps found on LAND records.
 
Then there are objects, which use NIF models. DynDOLOD does not create LOD models from full models. The DynDOLOD patcher uses the models and textures it finds in the load order to generate object and tree LOD with them. 
Object LOD is just supermeshes. Lots of different models are combined into one large mesh using one texture.
DynDOLOD Resources contains updated/new LOD models (and textures). They are created by making low poly versions of full models with tools like 3DS Max etc. In case a LOD models does not exist, DynDOLOD can use full models for LOD - as you did with the Azura's statue probably.
 
Immersive Fallen Trees places new objects, including trees. It does not change terrain. It does not contain any new assets. It only uses vanilla assets.
Some of these vanilla objects have LOD models and some don't.
So some of the newly added objects will have LOD and some don't.

 

LOD for objects is generated according to the mesh rules, which also define which LOD levels use which LOD model - if any at all. It does not make a difference if the references using the same objects (base records) are placed by Skyrim.esm or mod. They all receive the same LOD.

[VanGohman]

Thanks for the quick response sheson,

I had been messing around with the HD LOD Textures SE before, but perhaps I wasn't using them correctly. I'll give it another go.

It's nice to know that it wasn't supposed to just work with the Noble Skyrim texture pack, I really thought it was something I was doing wrong. :D

It's also good to know the fallen trees is a hit and miss for what can be added to the lod.

Off to test! :)

[VanGohman]

Now things are looking much less "vanilla" on Hunningbrew, with darker textures that are much closer to what I was seeing close up, maybe just a touch darker than the full sized textures, but a lot closer than before.

The only thing now is the detail of the arch over the door of the leftmost building disappears as I back away, is that just how detailed the lod can get, or should I try to further troubleshoot my textures? Maybe get rid of the overhaul I had laid down before Noble Skyrim...

Also, I'm using "SMIM Windmills Resized", and when I'm looking at the lod version, the lit window appears to be in front of the blades. When I'm up close it looks right... Was thinking about going back to regular sized windmills...



 

[VanGohman]

So using the HD LODs Textures SE, the lod textures on Hunningbrew are darker, and closer to the Noble Skyrim textures, but it's a bit darker overall than when I'm up close, and the big circular window on it is lighter in the lod than up close.

Being made with Noble Skyrim in mind, are they supposed to match better?

Also, when using the HD LODs Textures SE, the snowy bits in the distance are a dark grey, popping into bright whites and blues as I get close.

If I take this mod out of the picture after generating tex gen and DynDOLOD output, the dark greys go away, but now they look blurry, until I get close.

I'm also using better dynamic snow and better dynamic snow for Magestic Mountains for what it's worth.

I get the impression I should stick closely to the Noble Skyrim and Majestic Mountains base textures, and maybe not use other textures like these snow textures or the Realistic Overhaul textures to match best with the pre-generated HD LODs Textures SE pack?

[sheson]

The only thing now is the detail of the arch over the door of the leftmost building disappears as I back away, is that just how detailed the lod can get, or should I try to further troubleshoot my textures? Maybe get rid of the overhaul I had laid down before Noble Skyrim...

It probably is because Bethesda did not add certain feature to the LOD models or textures to begin with.

LOD models and textures are as detailed as the artist who created them wanted them to be. HD LOD textures updates existing vanilla LOD textures. It does not add new details AFAIK.

 

Also, I'm using "SMIM Windmills Resized", and when I'm looking at the lod version, the lit window appears to be in front of the blades. When I'm up close it looks right... Was thinking about going back to regular sized windmills...

Has nothing to do with LOD. That a side effect how the engine works with decals. Glowing windows are decals or they would start to z-flicker at a distance.

Notice the moss at the western watch tower, the corner stones of the Whiterun walls, vanilla glow LOD Windows of Whiterun etc.

 

So using the HD LODs Textures SE, the lod textures on Hunningbrew are darker, and closer to the Noble Skyrim textures, but it's a bit darker overall than when I'm up close, and the big circular window on it is lighter in the lod than up close.

 

Being made with Noble Skyrim in mind, are they supposed to match better?

 

Also, when using the HD LODs Textures SE, the snowy bits in the distance are a dark grey, popping into bright whites and blues as I get close.

 

If I take this mod out of the picture after generating tex gen and DynDOLOD output, the dark greys go away, but now they look blurry, until I get close.

 

I'm also using better dynamic snow and better dynamic snow for Magestic Mountains for what it's worth.

 

I get the impression I should stick closely to the Noble Skyrim and Majestic Mountains base textures, and maybe not use other textures like these snow textures or the Realistic Overhaul textures to match best with the pre-generated HD LODs Textures SE pack?

I did not make the textures. I have no idea what they are supposed to look like or if the parts you mention are covered by it or something else.

 

Follow the instructions correctly, the ones of the DynDOLOD manual (Load/Overwrite Orders) and the ones of the mods you are using. TexGen should always overwrite everything.

 

I explained how to identify if a LOD model uses pre-rendered LOD textures in the already mentioned thread.

 

If a LOD models uses pre-rendered LOD textures, you can check what textures the full model uses and which mod(s)modifies them. That might help with determining if updated object LOD textures exists / match.

Edited August 30, 2020 by sheson

[VanGohman]

Okay, this makes a lot of sense. I think I'm doing it right now, I was just expecting the lod to match perfectly, when it's just a lot closer now than with the vanilla lod.

I can see even the vanilla lod is off from the vanilla close range, probably even more off than it is right now with with the Noble Skyrim and HD Lod mods.

I can see why they use the decals at a distance, it's nice to know I can call the dogs off of that one.

I think it's because of how well Dyndolod does it's thing that I expected perfection, but it's so much better looking overall that I'm just blown away at what it can do. I've always been able to meet the vanilla graphics half way with all of it's shortcomings, and now with DynDolod, it's even easier to suspend my disbelief.

Thanks for everything, it's so appreciated.

[VanGohman]

Hey Sheson,

I have gotten the Noble Skyrim textures from the HD Lod pack to show up on the buildings now, but my current battle has to do with snow textures in the distance.

As I was saying before, I'm using the Realistic Overhaul textures as a base, the Noble Skyrim textures on top of that, the Majestic Mountains with it's lod and complimentary texture packs, followed by realistic ice and snow, and the cherry on top is the Just Ice textures for the glaciers and ice.

The Realistic Snow and Ice is showing up on my near snow underfoot, but in the distance these textures are appearing a bit blue. Not on the mountain tops as I've seen others getting in other threads I've found here, but on the ground in the distance.

Please take a look at this video I've uploaded here:

I'm just starting to figure out xedit, maybe I just need to figure out what other mods mess with this snow texture? Or perhaps the texture is the right one, but it's got some kind of shader effect?

For kicks I've tried removing my vivid weathers/true storms mods, but even then I'm getting a similar blue result on this near-distant snow.

Or maybe this is just another limitation of the game engine that can't be worked around? I know I see stuff like this in a lot of other people's streams. But then again I know sometimes people have nice white snow all over. Is there perhaps a recommended snow texture combination that blends better? Maybe I should be using bluer snow in the foreground so it matches up better?

Thanks again for all you do Sheson.
 

[VanGohman]

Oh yeah, and one other thing you can see in this video is how the glacier ice looks greyer than the close up glaciers, which are a light blue.

I get the feeling that this is due to most ice overhauls not including their own lod textures?

I've seen posts from people who gave up trying to make that stuff match better, which again makes me wonder if there's a best case scenario texture combination for ice and snow when it comes to DynDoLod.

One other thing to mention here now that I remember it, is I ended up deleting a snow texture in the HD Texture pack (the one I was missing earlier in this thread that better matches the Noble Skyrim building textures) that was overwriting Majestic Mountains, which was causing the distant glaciers to look even darker, including the snow on top of it.

[sheson]

Purple tinted typically means missing textures. This probably is terrain LOD - which is odd, since it should fall back to the vanilla terrain LOD textures.

 

To determine if this is LOD, use tll in console to toggle LOD on and off.

 

To determine if this is terrain LOD, remove all terrain LOD meshes/textures from the load order so it uses vanilla terrain LOD.

 

To determine if this object LOD, remove all object LOD meshes/textures from the load order so it uses vanilla object LOD.

 

The glaciers in the distance use pre-rendered object LOD textures. You need to manually update them if mods do not contain a matching versions.

Edited September 7, 2020 by sheson

[VanGohman]

Thanks for the direction.

 

I've turned off all (I think) added textures, trying to get my game closer to it's vanilla appearance, and it seems like my near snow better matches the slightly far glaciers grayness that I was seeing before, but the lod seems to be a brighter white. I also remove the lod in this video, which leaves me with mostly matching grey snow.

Can you tell me if this is how vanilla is supposed to look? I can't remember anymore.

Thanks again.

[sheson]

This looks like vanilla with the "improved' snow shader enabled and all its visual issues and bugs.

[VanGohman]

This is another quick snapshot of how things look with all of my mods turned on for posterity...

 

I was reading about people disabling the "improved" snow shader (from SE release), but I think I wasn't able to find the suggested ini tweak in my ini files, so I assumed the VR version must not have had it...

Maybe I needed to manually add it in...

[sheson]

Looks like there are textures missing or there was a bluish landscape snow texture installed when those terrain LOD textures were generated.

[VanGohman]

Doing some research, it turns out that the ini setting that turns off the SE "improved" snow shader "bEnableImprovedSnow=0" doesn't work with the VR version.

In other news, the VR version also doesn't support esl flags, so my quest to go over the 255 plugins I'm using now continues. I guess I should be merging mods with xedit and or using wrye bash, but I'm not sure the latter works with the vr verison just yet.

In the end here, I went through and kept the "Noble Skyrim"/"Majestic Mountains" with complimentary textures and LOD pack, along  with "Just Ice" on top, which seems to have evened out the blues between the near and distant snow. The "Just Ice" makes the brighter white on the glacier ice areas blend in a little better. No matter what I do, I always have a slight mis-match between the near and far glaciers pattern-wise, but at least the color tones are closer now.

Looks like those lod bits turned varying shades of brighter blue when using: "Fluffy Snow", "Nordic Snow (HD Snow)" or "RIS - Real Ice and Snow".

The only other thing to mention is I'm using the Majestic Mountains with Better Dynamic Snow and the patch for both of them "Better Majestic Mountains". Along with the "complimentary textures" and "lod pack" for MM.

Even after running xLodGEN, TexGen, and DynDOLOD, the patterns on the mountains still pop in as I get closer, similar to the glaciers mismatch I can't seem to get around.

Is this texture pop in expected?

Also, there is this huge hole in the sea texture (giant rectangle), way off behind Winterhold, is that just how Skyrim is? Or did I do that with one of my mods?

Thanks again for walking me through this.