CTD at 3.1GB

[viking]

Some key posts on this and related threads (experts feel free to note any errors or insights):

• Post #11
• Post #27
• Post #40 (this is where the 500/430 ratio seems to have originated.)
• Post #66
• Post#278
• Post #313
• Post #1 (adjacent thread: Caution about memory optimisers)
• Post #64 (adjacent thread: Caution about memory optimisers)
• Post #68 (adjacent thread: Caution about memory optimisers)
• Post #70 (adjacent thread: Caution about memory optimisers)

Wiki article (draft)

 

Thanks,

STEP

 

OP follows

---

First of all I wanted to thank you all for the great work you have done with STEP. Skyrim is the first game I installed on this computer and you guys have made it an AMAZING game. That being said, I have an issue that I hope you can help me solve.

 

My setup:

Vanilla Skyrim

gtx670 w/ 4GB @1080p w/ latest driver

16GB Memory

3770K at about 4GHz

Windows 8 64bit

ENB 149

Ultra settings

Highest available texture/quality

Mod Organizer

Step 2.2.1 + Skyrim Revisited + others

 

I have noticed a post here and there saying that Skyrim can't really address more than about 3.1GB of memory without issues. This seems to jive with my experience, meaning I CTD every time my memory hits that mark, but I couldn't really find anything definitive on the topic. The issue with googling the topic is the pre 1.3 skyrim that couldn't address more than 2gb of memory.

 

My mod list is mostly based on STEP which is why I came here for help, with about ten mods added onto the end (Interesting NPCs, Detailed Cities, Economics, COT, and a couple others). The reason I haven't included my mod list is that it doesn't seem to matter. As long as I keep the memory usage below 3GB I can have pretty much any combination of mods.

 

What I have tried so far (in no particular order):

• resetting ini files
• removing enb
• not using attklt
• only using a new game
• removing all mods and adding one by one until issue crops up
• running as admin
• watching the papyrus log - it seems relatively clean, no obvious errors right before CTD

Yes, I can run STEP just fine without any issues, but I also never get near 3GB of memory. I have tracked VRAM usage as well and have seen a max of 2.7GB/4GB.

 

As an example of where I might run into issues: I start a new character with Alternate Start. I start with Breezehome. Run out of Whiterun, past the Brewry, up the hill to the bandits. Enter the cave (watching memory usage with Elys MemInfo), and it dies right after I see 3GB. I have this same issue not using AS, sitting through the intro, and then running over to whiterun.

 

I'm sorry if this post is all over the place. I have spent more than a week trying to solve this issue, and the only solution I have found is to reduce memory usage. I have got to the point where I can exchange two texture packs and get into the cave without a CTD, but with both I get a CTD. I didn't even think texture packs should even affect CTDs, but I'm relatively new to Skyrim on the PC, so I could be wrong. I also found I could get a bit further with ENB turned off, but would still crash once I got above 3GB of memory. Finally, if I reload a game after a CTD, I can play just fine...until I reach 3GB of memory.

 

I really hope you guys can help. I more than willing to try anything at this point, besides just disabling all of the mods.

[julsnice]

Didn't read through the entire thread but just wanted to post that I was just running Skyrim with 150+ mods and an ENB and everything was fine till I approached Whiterun for the 1st time, then my system slowed to a crawl, (like 5 frames per minute). It didn't crash but was so bad it crippled my computer response (couldn't even CTRL+ALT+DELETE) so I had to eventually switch to desktop and quit.

 

Funny thing was that when I quit Task Manager showed TESV was already over 3.24 GBs

[TeleToko]

I too have been running into ctd's from maxing out my RAM, and wanted to share something interesting that I've found in my search for a solution. By using the console command pcb (PurgeCellBuffers) I have been able to prevent crashes at points where I would normally be sure to have a ctd. The pcb command will clean out buffered memory which Skyrim uses to shorten load times on cell changes.

 

I have been monitoring my RAM and VRAM usage with Skyrim Performance Monitor on dozens of testruns from Helgen to Whiterun passing several points which are prone to ctd's, namely running op to Riverwood, the crossroads between Riverwood and Whiterun, the Companions fight with the giant and the cell changes in Whiterun. By using the pcb command I can free up some 200Mb (approach to Riverwood) upto more then 1000Mb! of RAM (after a couple of cell changes in Whiterun). This buffered load is often the difference between a crash or no crash. Another observation is that after using the pcb command my VRAM is reduced by nearly the same amount as my RAM which seems to indicate that VRAM is indeed mirrored.

 

While this certainly isn't a proper solution of any kind - having to hawkeye RAM usage and typing console commands is pretty immersion breaking and not the way I would like to play - I believe it's still an interisting insight in Skyrims mechanics, and may be worth to occasionally use on large outdoor travels where crashes seem to occur most often.

 

For reference my setup: i3750K @ 4.4 Ghz, 8Gb RAM @ 1600, XFX HD7950 Black 3Gb, 1920x1080, Skyrim installed on SSD, Mod Organizer for installation. Full STEP 2.2.2 with TPC and some other mods on top including CoT, RLO, Frostfall, Immersive Armors, Winter is Coming and some ERSO modules. Textures at 2K, the large texture packs ddsopted to 1K normals.

[JudgmentJay]

Yeah, pcb works well, but I've read that it can cause some issues if you use it outside. It'd be nice if there was a mod or script that could run the pcb command every time you transitioned from an exterior cell to an interior and vice versa.

[fox]

Anecdotal: I've been getting CTDs from maxing out around 3.1GB of RAM usage too (Skyrim Performance Monitor confirms this when I view it after a CTD).

 

I was getting VRAM-based crashes too from hitting my card's 3GB ceiling, but I have resolved those. VRAM usage is now normally around 2.5GB.

 

This is running:

STEP

Texture Pack Combiner w/ SRO and most optional files at 2048x. No Lush Trees/Lush Grass. Flora Overhaul loaded in NMM separately from TPC

Bethesda hi-res DLC

ENB 0.155 w/ SMAA

Immersive Weapons

Immersive Armours

Convenient Horses

And a couple of other random mods

 

Single 1920x1080 display

AA/AF disabled in the launcher

Ugrids at default values

And a couple of other random mods.

 

i5 760 @ 3.8GHz

8GB Ram

Radeon 7950 3GB

 

Currently I haven't optimised anything at all with BSAOpt/DDSOpt, so naturally that will be where I start! My RAM usage does seem to be very high though, compared to what others are reporting.

[DoYouEvenModBro]

Post has been deleted

[Siwel187]

Anecdotal: I've been getting CTDs from maxing out around 3.1GB of RAM usage too (Skyrim Performance Monitor confirms this when I view it after a CTD).

 

I was getting VRAM-based crashes too from hitting my card's 3GB ceiling, but I have resolved those. VRAM usage is now normally around 2.5GB.

 

This is running:

STEP

Texture Pack Combiner w/ SRO and most optional files at 2048x. No Lush Trees/Lush Grass. Flora Overhaul loaded in NMM separately from TPC

Bethesda hi-res DLC

ENB 0.155 w/ SMAA

Immersive Weapons

Immersive Armours

Convenient Horses

And a couple of other random mods

 

Single 1920x1080 display

AA/AF disabled in the launcher

Ugrids at default values

And a couple of other random mods.

 

i5 760 @ 3.8GHz

8GB Ram

Radeon 7950 3GB

 

Currently I haven't optimised anything at all with BSAOpt/DDSOpt, so naturally that will be where I start! My RAM usage does seem to be very high though, compared to what others are reporting.

You have to be lying.

 

I have pretty much exactly the same mods installed as you, some of them maybe at lower resolutions.

 

I have nearly the same computer specs as you too. Apart from i have a Ivy i5 3570k and a 3gb 7970

 

My Vram useage always pushes 3gb and i max out my card too.

 

And that is with the SMCO optimizations done.

[Flytrap]

Hey, folks. New guy here. Been tinkering with this for a while, and I posted in another thread that the only thing I have been able to to do to reduce SYSTEM RAM usage is drop my 4K texture packs in favor of 2K ones. I kept 4K textures from Trees HD and Vurt's Hi-Res Pines add-on to Skyrim Flora Overhaul (resized down to 4K) because I run Skyrim Bigger Trees, so I get up close and personal with a lot of big tree trunks and pine branches.

 

I also made several test saves in key CTD-prone areas, and re-ran them over and over while monitoring with Skyrim Performance Monitor until I was able to get CTDs down to almost 0. They were:

1. Guardian Stones running to Riverwood

2. Honningbrew Meadery to Whiterun main gate

3. Mountain pass between Riverwood and Bleak Falls Barrow with the troll

4. Entering every building in Riverwood one after another (fills up cell buffers)

5. Entering and exiting the Bannered Mare repeatedly

6. Same for Bleak Falls Barrow dungeon

 

Now system RAM usage gets very near but almost never over 3GB.

 

I also had to cut "iPreloadSizeLimit=xxx" from Skyrim.ini because for me it caused crashes everytime I entered Bleak Falls (boy, did THAT take a long time to figure out).

 

I hope this advice can help someone else.

 

Some random screenshots:

https://imgur.com/a/iYNUi

 

Specs:

i7 3820 + 2x GeForce 680 4GB SLI + 4x4GB RAM

 

Mods:

95% STEP 2.2.3 with all 2K textures + 4K Trees HD + 4K Hi-Res Pines from Skyrim Flora Overhaul

SFO Summer Edition + Overgrown add-on (iMinGrassSize=10 in Skyrim INI to thicken it up)

Skyrim Bigger Trees (placed before SFO and Trees HD in Mod Organizer to get their textures)

Realistic Lighting Overhaul

Climates of Tamriel

SkyRealism ENB Cinematic (reduced saturation slightly for RLO)

- Every setting enabled except EnableReflections because it gave me strange stutters when looking around in dungeons without maxing any resources

Immersive Armors & Weapons (plus aMidianBorn's IA textures)

Cloaks of Skyrim + Winter is Coming

Telescope

Wet and Cold

Build Your Own Home

Expanded Towns and Cities

Atlas Map Markers

Beast Skeletons

Frostfall + 2K Cloaks add-on

SkyRealism Simple Save System

Arrows in the Everywhere

Increased First-Person Height

Dovahkiin Relaxes Too

[DoYouEvenModBro]

Post has been deleted

[Flytrap]

Say, you're right. Must have been residual from when I experimented with uGrids a while back (I never inhaled!). Will correct that! Thanks!

 

-Flytrap

[Gyro]

You have to be lying.

 

No need to accuse someone of lying.  There could be other factors at play.

[DoYouEvenModBro]

Post has been deleted

[Flytrap]

@joshkope: I also have been frustrated by running into this problem after a PC upgrade, and I mentioned some things earlier, but have since done even more experimenting. Like you, I discovered 3 GB crashes around Windhelm, even after the extensive testing I mentioned above, so I added a test save in an indoor cell at Anga's Mill down the road, and ran to the Windhelm gate with Skyrim Performance Monitor running until I got it licked.

 

I am running at 1920x1080, and the changes I have made that had the biggest impact on decreasing RAM usage while maintaining visual quality in order are:

 

1) Resizing all textures to a max of 2048. The only exception to this, as I said earlier, is I use Vurt's Hi-res Pines from the optional files in Skyrim Flora Overhaul resized down to 4096.

 

2) Installing the "Hybrid+Vanilla Normal Maps" version of HRDLC Optimized. After resizing my textures, this has given me the single biggest decrease in system RAM usage (around 2-400 MB around Windhelm gate) with (to my eyes) insignificant decrease in quality. In the comparison shots on the mod page on the Nexus, the differences are obvious. During my actual time playing the game, however, I haven't been able to tell a difference except now I don't crash when I visit Windhelm.

 

3) Disabling mods that improve bodies, clothing, weapons, and armor. This one may not be necessary after the first two, but it is worth noting that I tried this during some of my testing because maintaining environment quality was more important to me than NPC quality. So, I turned off the XCE, Better Feet, Better Freckles, Better Circlets, Book of Silence, Elemental Staves, etc., and I did see decrease in RAM without having to sacrifice environment textures. For me, I don't think this is necessary after doing 1 and 2, but if I get crashes again, this is where I'll start testing.

 

Best of luck. I know how frustrating it can be to run into this when your rig has horsepower to spare and should be eating STEP for breakfast. It has been a couple of weeks of repetitive testing, but I am now actually playing Skyrim instead of fixing Skyrim, and I hope this advice helps someone else do the same until a better solution comes along (if it ever does!).

 

Take care,

Flytrap

[DoYouEvenModBro]

Post has been deleted

[Flytrap]

Thanks for your input. I can't tell you how disappointed I am with this. Did you use ddsopt or texture optimizer to re-size the texture packs? Or did you just download the lite versions?

I used Optimizer Textures instead of DDSOpt. Most people around here would probably do the opposite, but I discovered OT first, and I only needed the resizing features. It was super easy to use. Like you, I had used as many hi-res packs as I could find, so I just resized them instead of going back to get the 2K or less versions. Some, like the Trees HD 4K pack, still look great when resized. In my experience, the 4K pack resized to 2K looks better than the 2K available on Nexus, and is nearly indiscernible from the original, even up close at 1080p. YMMV.

I will also try the HRDLC Optimized although I think it will be obvious that the textures are lower quality. I really hope there is a fix for this or else I don't know how STEP can continue to grow since a lot of users are hitting the 3.1 gb RAM ceiling.

Don't forget that when you try the Hybrid+Vanilla Normal Maps HRDLC Optimized, you are going to be overwriting many of the textures you see with better one from Skyrim HD, Serious HD, etc., so don't worry too much about lo-res textures everywhere. It's the vanilla normals that made the difference to me. I tried it without HRDLC Optimized, with Hybrid 2048+1024, and with Hybrid+Vanilla Normals, and the last one really made the difference performance wise, and, like I said, I am hard pressed to notice a difference. I do agree, though, that more and more folks could see problems with this, and I hope a solution comes about. Until then, well, here we are. :)

Also, if you put bigger trees before TreesHD and Vurts, it will use their textures? Because I read something saying that the mod stretches and worsens textures but that isn't the case if you place it before Vurts and Trees HD?

Exactly. In the Mod Organizer left pane where you determine texture overwrite precedence, I placed Skyrim Bigger Trees just before Skyrim Flora Overhaul, which comes before Trees HD per STEP. Then, I let BOSS sort the .esp load order.

 

-Flytrap

[DoYouEvenModBro]

Post has been deleted