Wrye Bash title bar includes the name of an inactive MO profile

[GrantSP]

I have just now noticed something which may well be an obvious matter, but since I can't figure out how it is constructed I thought I'd ask.

 

I work almost exclusively through MO so when I tried something just now to see if it might be related to another topic, I noticed something odd about what is contained in the title bar of WB.

 

I have a number of MO profiles one of which is called "Warrior with followers" which as you can figure out is geared towards melee action with follower support. Anyway, of all the times I start WB via MO the title bar says:

Wrye Smash 305(Standalone): Default

I took no notice and assumed that is just the same for all instances of it running. No matter which MO profile I use, WB loads them correctly and it always says the same thing.

 

Now I ran WB outside of MO to see whether an actual bashed patch in the data directory might conflict with WB execution when run from within MO. It doesn't BTW.

What I noticed was the title bar from this instance of WB, started outside of MO, had in it's title bar "Warrior with Followers" in place of "Default". Further to add to the confusion, no matter which MO profile I have set in MO the WB run from outside of MO ALWAYS refers to that profile.

 

What I want to know is:

1. How does an instance of WB that is started from outside of MO pull this profile's name into it's title bar?
2. What does this mean as to the way WB handles plugin lists? Is this somehow trying to copy the functionality from WB's save games profile system?
3. Where is that setting stored?

 

[z929669]

Did you ever edit your Bash.ini? I would check there first for that string. Also, you might check the WB files under %USERPROFILE%\Documents\My Games\Skyrim\ ... similarly, check under %APPDATA%\Skyrim (I think) ... I am not on my home box, so all of these paths are from memory.

 

What I do know, is that when launching WB via MO, WB thinks it sees /Data/. ... but I have never investigated where it gets its own meta info when run under MO (I assume the MO profiles contain this).

[GrantSP]

As far as I can see all those locations contain no information that would point to my MO profile, especially one that might be inactive.

 

I did at one time try to link WB's save game profile system to MO's profile system by adding symlinks to the save directory. That partially worked but only in one-direction, ie. you shouldn't try to change profiles in WB if it is run via MO, it does... bad things! But... that still doesn't help me find where the settings are stored.

I made the same assumption you did as to the meta info.

 

I'll keep looking, thanks.

[z929669]

Maybe the symlink tweaks you made are haunting you with this issue ... ?

[Sharlikran]

I hate to burst your bubble but that part at the top is the save game profile.  Read this part of the documentation and watch this.  It really has nothing to do with mods.  In the video I stutter and show that my Bash Patch is back where it's supposed to be.  I interrupted my train of thought and then I explain that Wrye Bash will not automatically install and uninstall the mods depending on the Save game profile you have chosen.  However, it will manage your load order and active plugins.  Mod Organizer installs dll files to create the virtual folder for the mods, my question would be does it alter how the saves folder works.

Edited January 14, 2015 by Sharlikran

[GrantSP]

I hate to burst your bubble but that part at the top is the save game profile.  Read this part of the documentation and watch this.  It really has nothing to do with mods.  In the video I stutter and show that my Bash Patch is back where it's supposed to be.  I interrupted my train of thought and then I explain that Wrye Bash will not automatically install and uninstall the mods depending on the Save game profile you have chosen.  However, it will manage your load order and active plugins.  Mod Organizer installs dll files to create the virtual folder for the mods, my question would be does it alter how the saves folder works.

Thanks, but I know it should be the save game profile but I can't see where that information is saved.

In both situations, via MO or alone, Wrye Bash has no profiles anywhere, I removed them. Right-clicking on the Saves tab of WB brings up the context menu from where I can select: Profiles -- Edit Profiles... and it shows no profiles. There should be at least the Default and the listed profile in that context menu.

 

Wait a minute... I re-tried that process again. Right-click, blah, blah, this time I clicked on the only option available, a blank space at the bottom.

Now the Saves tab is populated with saved games and the title bar has changed to Default.

Also invoking the context menu shows two profiles Default and the Warrior one with Default checked.

Tried it from MO and the same thing. Two profiles are shown whereas before no named profiles were visible.

From here I have removed all profiles and only have the Default and the UI seems to functioning as expected.

 

This sort of thing bugs me when it gets resolved but I don't know why. I am not blind, there were no named profiles visible and the context menu is now showing the correct information. Maybe I did stuff things up when I tried to link the MO & WB save folders. My question though still remains:

Where is that information stored for WB to access it and why did the MO version not look to the same location?

As I've been typing this I did system wide search for files accessed during that little experiment, seems I couldn't see the easiest files to see that would change those settings when I looked before. BashProfiles.dat is the culprit. Although it isn't text, the profile listed seems to be referenced in it.

So it would seem there is much much more to getting WB & MO profiles synced than just the locations of the save folders. Unless MO could get access to that folder and make changes to it, it will be forever stuck in the last set profile, with dire consequences to saves and settings as I found out before.

 

I think it would be safer for all if we steer clear of trying to use that WB feature from within MO. It may be possible but will need some code change to gain access to BashProfiles.dat and setting up symlinks to save folders isn't for everybody.

 

Thank you both for that extra little push that got me to look harder.

PS. The link to your video is set to private so I couldn't view it.

[z929669]

OK, I recently reinstalled Windows and am running on a clean system. When I launch WB (Py version, using launcher) directly, I get exactly what I expect. I have no profiles set under WB, so I see none, and I have not generated bashprofiles.dat.

 

WB default save-game directory is under

%USERPROFILE%\Documents\my games\skyrim\saves

and MO's is under

.\Mod Organizer\profiles\<profilename>\saves

I set my directory locations in MO exactly like I set them in Bash.ini, so either way I launch, I see different save games. I created a new profile under WB stand-alone, and this created a blank profile with assets located in a like-named folder under my WB save location.

 

If I run WB through MO, I get exactly the same behavior with respect to all aspects but for two fundamental differences:

1. MO virtualizes %USERPROFILE%\Documents\my games\skyrim\saves\ as .\Mod Organizer\profiles\\saves
2. MO virtualizes \Data as

Everything above these directories is identical from the WB viewpoint, but everything below them is dictated by independent user profiles and game directories.

 

Since this is all configurable, and you have messed around with Windows symlinks of certain folders, you very well may have relics causing strange behavior or something related to directory locations. If you made any other config changes to either MO or WB, then that could be the issue as well.

 

I would save all of my profile info under each and then recreate fresh folder structures and uninstall both programs completely. Then reinstall and copy the files (less their parent folders) back over and try again. I am assuming that you have all of the WB dependencies installed ... there should be 3 I think ... Python 2.7, PyWin, and ComTypes. Your config may seem OK now, but I would not trust it ... nor would I want to track down the root cause in your situation.

 

Anyway, you probably know all this stuff, but I have played around enough with WB to have been burned on my config errors more than once over the past 9 years or so ... especially the Python versions for Oblivion, when you could install all kinds of addons to enhance functionality.

[GrantSP]

Did you copy the saves to specific profile names when you created them?

That was why I had to set symlinks.

Everything you say is good, that weird UI glitch worries me though, the profile context menu not showing the profiles.

Anyway the main/only reason I use WB, bashed patches, was never broken so all is good.

Edited January 14, 2015 by GrantSP

[z929669]

Did you copy the saves to specific profile names when you created them?

That was why I had to set symlinks.

Everything you say is good, that weird UI glitch worries me though, the profile context menu not showing the profiles.

Anyway the main/only reason I use WB, bashed patches, was never broken so all is good.

I have copied saves from amongst all of my MO and WB profiles, and they show up as expected when launching WB stand-alone or via MO. I am not sure that symlinking MO profiles to %USERPROFILE%\Documents\my games\skyrim\saves\ would work as expected, due to MO virtualization nuances that I don't understand; however, symlinking %USERPROFILE%\Documents\my games\skyrim\saves\ to .\Mod Organizer\profiles\\saves might be better.

 

The profile glitch you speak of is not manifest in my setup, so I question whether or not the symlinks you had set may be the culprit.

[GrantSP]

I'm ready to concede that the symlinks are the culprit in my UI glitch.

 

My only question about your setup would be:

Are new saves generated in game seen by both tools immediately, or do you need to manually update one of the locations?

 

The reason I used symlinks was because I couldn't see how a new save would appear in two separate locations.

The method I used is outlined in this post.

 

Whichever the case, I think this is only an intellectual curiosity, I wouldn't recommend advising anyone to do this. It's just not worth it.

[z929669]

Correct. I must manually copy the saves amongst the profiles. Symlinking is the most elegant method, but I would use WB to MO only. An alternative is to set up a batch sync between folder pairs as a task at some frequency.

 

Yes, not advisable for anyone but testers

 

EDIT: I may give symlinks a try myself after testing a bit more of the behavior without. Will let you know what happens.

 

Note that another issue is that save and profile folders at either location have inverse relationship to the other. Seems like infinite recursion may be possible with wrong symlinks. Each folder would need to symlink I think without recursion. Not sure though.

[Sharlikran]

I apologize I have not been following this I don't know why it didn't add me when I responded.  I can't believe I set the permissions wrong for the video.  I marked it as unlisted now.  Also when I made that video I made it to use for future reference so I could link to other people that have not used that tab before.

 

It looks like you have figured out most of it.  The only information you needed more than likely is at 3:00 the rest seems like it might be review for you.  Watch it if you want.

Edited January 25, 2015 by Sharlikran