Does having lots of in-game items in Skyrim cause instability?

[MagnusThorek]

In my latest playthrough I'm running any quest mod that teases my curiosity.

But I'm also a Completionist (or 'Garbage Collector/Resource Hoarder', if you prefer) so, everything from every mod (armors, weapons, statics, journals, notes...) as much as I can find (MurderWrath and mannyGT's mods are very tricky) I keep in chests, wardrobes or desks.

 

This is true for supplies too. I have tons of ores, ingots (mostly coming from melting unused items with an uncraft mod), hides, gems and ingredients, even if I might not need all of them.

And recently, with my new GPU, a GTX 660 2GB, I noticed that Skyrim still very buggy. I have random CTDs, mostly when loading a new cell, like leaving a shop or entering my home (Elysium Estate). These are the most annoying, of course, but the loading time is very frustrating too. And worse! The overall performance now in Ultra Quality is not greater than it was with my iGPU in Medium Quality.

I read here and there that big save game files (mine are ~25MB each, with 600+ hours) can cause these issues. I tried to clean them with tools provided in Nexus site but the size still the same, which probably means there is no unintentional leftovers. Right now I'm testing the PDT.

I already played Skyrim 7 times, you know. And I always was the collector kind of player. For example. I have the Dovahkiin Wardrobe Room, which is very spartan in visual terms but it's the only mod I've found providing 250 mannequins. There I have all armor sets that worth to keep, Vanilla, DB and DG. But I also have armors/clothes from mods, like Konahriik's Accountrements and Opulent Outfits.

 

So... If I want to reduce my save game files, and thus reduce the stuttering, lag, random CTDs and long load times, do I have to empty all my bookshelves (which I filled with every single book, mostly handpicked in Apocrypha), dispose all unique items coming from quest mods, reduce my storage to a barely minimum amount of supplies and throw away all armor sets of each tier just to get stability?

 

Right now I have 203 active mods (ESPs and ESMs). If you can help me solve or at least improve this annoyance, tell me if you would need the MO list and I'll provide.

[phazer11]

First. Make sure your SKSE (Sheson) Memory Patch is functioning correctly.

https://forum.step-project.com/topic/6726-common-ctds-freezes-ils-and-memory-issues/

If it is working correctly and you're still having issues please post your enblocal.ini in spoilers like so:

[spoiler]
Text here
[/spoiler]

Other than that it may just be that you installed uninstalled too many mods, or did not do enough conflict resolution  or that the save games are as you said too bloated for whatever reason.

[Aiyen]

The more stuff you keep in one location the more memory that single area is going to require, since everything is loaded in full detail more or less... probably more since it is a closed of interior cell as I understand it. 

 

This means if you have LOADS of high quality textures that you can get swamped really quickly. When people say the can run with 2k-4k textures etc. then it is under normal playing conditions where half the game is not loaded at once. 

 

So yes it would be correct to say that having more and more and more items will cause instability since you use more memory up to the point where your hardware just cannot cope any longer. 

[MagnusThorek]

@phazer11:

According to the link you posted, it is working. The MBL reported the same quoted by the author:
 

logging of blocks enabled
logging max values only
Timer disabled
Block1 Block2
512MB 256MB

 
According to Gopher's video I should look in the last line when and if the game crashes or freezes. I was walking down the 7000 Steps as part of Thundering Child mod and when I was almost in the bottom of it, the game crashed and the log registered as values of blocks 360 and 204, respectively.

I don't understand much but I think it shouldn't crash before these heaps, right?

I also tried the "spawn NPCs" method. I spawned 300 Whiterun Guards around me and not crash, just the expected lag.

About ENB, I was so frustrated because the GPU I paid a good money (mostly because in my country importing taxes and Customs suck) didn't end good enough to keep Skyrim running smoothly, I decide, at least for now, to not use ENB, although I really wanted to.

Elys MemInfo reports almost constant 60 FPS, which should be enough for ENB, but everytime I turn the camera or when what I think to be new cells being loaded, the FPS drop, sometimes drastically (especially in or around Elysium Estate). And with previous experience when the FPS drop that much I almost always crashed. Another reason to skip ENB until solve the issue.

@Ayien:

I noticed that in Dovahkiin Wardrobe Room that has several mannequins in the same cell. But those in containers too? Isn't there anything that can be done?

[Aiyen]

To be honest I think you are the first one with this kind of problem, and setup. 

 

It could be related to memory, it could just be you have an old save with too many changes having been made to down the road. 

Add that you have a complex sounding list on top of all that and I am rather surprised that the game is even running as it is! 

 

Lag issues and stuttering due to just turning the camera, is normally due to either stuff still being loaded from memory, or due to shadow settings. 

You can make sure your shadow resolutions do not exceed 1k and see if that helps. At 1k resolutions all shadow related issues should be ruled out. 

 

Containers and such should not load the items until you open them up and it has to display the preview of the item. It is known that when a container or crafting lists gets too long the game will get very CTD prone. Especially if you scroll through the list quickly. 

 

All it takes is one mesh not loading properly or finding what it needs to make the game CTD. 

[phazer11]

Are you saying it wasn't good enough to run SKyrim smoothly with ENB or in general? If Vividian ENB or Skylight ENB are too performance intensive... then just use ENBoost it's really important to have nothing less than ENBoost.

[MagnusThorek]

To be honest I think you are the first one with this kind of problem, and setup. 

 

It could be related to memory, it could just be you have an old save with too many changes having been made to down the road. 

Add that you have a complex sounding list on top of all that and I am rather surprised that the game is even running as it is! 

 

Lag issues and stuttering due to just turning the camera, is normally due to either stuff still being loaded from memory, or due to shadow settings. 

You can make sure your shadow resolutions do not exceed 1k and see if that helps. At 1k resolutions all shadow related issues should be ruled out. 

 

Containers and such should not load the items until you open them up and it has to display the preview of the item. It is known that when a container or crafting lists gets too long the game will get very CTD prone. Especially if you scroll through the list quickly. 

 

All it takes is one mesh not loading properly or finding what it needs to make the game CTD. 

 

I was reading some optimization guides and because I don`t really pay much attention to shadows I decided for good to removed them using Shadow Remover mod. I also reduced the Radial Blur and it helped, most of the time.

 

Like I said I tested this PDT and it reduced my save games by 4MB, but the random CTDs persisted. Then I enabled the Papyrus logs and added it to the program and more detailed informations were reported, although I didn't understand a thing >_<

 

I tried to read this log by myself and I searching a bit the not-so-descriptive names, I noticed errors/warnings related to Real Clouds, Alternate Start and Agents of Righteous Might. What I don't undertand is the last two mods are already finished, except because the ARM had some uniques I collected and dropped somewhere in Elysium Estate.

 

Right now, testing The Wheels of Lull I needed some gold ingots and I'm trying for the 5th time fast travel to Elysium Estate and I'm always crashing.

 

Is there a list of known buggy mods I should remove or at least a way to give more time or more power to these scripts to run?

 

Are you saying it wasn't good enough to run SKyrim smoothly with ENB or in general? If Vividian ENB or Skylight ENB are too performance intensive... then just use ENBoost it's really important to have nothing less than ENBoost.

I thought it was in general. I mean, I expected some FPS reduction, between 20~30 but when running around I've got som sttutering and sometimes, right after teh FPS stabilizes back to higher numbers, I crashed.

 

And this ENBoost, I've heard about it in several articles, but I don't really know what it is. If I have to install it manually, if it's part of ENB... Maybe I'm very stupid but I think these things should be explained more clearly.

 

Well... I liked the results of TrueVision... in the videos I've seen. I'll try this Vividian ENB later, as soon as I stabilize the game.

[phazer11]

Well to get more stability you'll need the ENBoost feature of either ENB or ENBoost.

https://wiki.step-project.com/ENBoost#Recommendations

https://wiki.step-project.com/Guide:ENB#tab=ENBoost

 

Make sure you have the Skyrim.ini and SkyrmPrefs.ini from here

https://wiki.step-project.com/STEP:2.2.9#1.D._INI_Tweaks

 

I recommend Skylight or Vividian

https://wiki.step-project.com/Guide:ENB#Recommended_ENB_Presets

https://wiki.step-project.com/Skylight_ENB

https://wiki.step-project.com/Vividian_ENB

[MagnusThorek]

I modified my INI using the guide you linked before start this topic. The only things I changed was those mentioned by Shadow Remover as I read shadows are terrible and performance glutton and I don`t pay much attention to them anyway.

 

Now I "installed" the ENB without presets, configure it according to your link and thestuttering while moving the camera became worse! Fine, I didn't have any other CTD which is a victory, but I was in Dawstar testing Morskom Estate mod and a dragon appeared. Fine, I was ready to fight, but I had ZERO FPS for several seconds and huge FPS drops while moving towards the dragon.

 

Regretably, I would even consider "delete" hundreds of items I've kept, holding only the most special, if that helps the problem.

 

I'm linking my Papyrus log and active mod list¹ could help? That's not possible that much of problems.

 

If you could give me a personal opinion about the mods I have so I can remove some that are problemamtic or simply bullsh... I would appreciate too.

 

¹ The mod list is in CSV, tell me if it's a problem

[Aiyen]

If you do not have a properly setup ENBoost section of ENB, then you will get massive stuttering etc. Also if you did not even have it installed then it would explain your CTDs. You simply ran out of memory with all the items. ENBoost does provide you with a larger memory room to play with. 

 

Also make sure to disable any logging etc... it does put a lot of extra strain on the game when it has to do that as well, and have been known to actually cause the issues you where meant to find doing it. 

[MagnusThorek]

Because I never installed ENB "for real" I configure my enblocal.ini as close as possible to the link provided.

 

In order to allow possible validation, my specs (since I don't know how to add it to Wiki Profile), or at least the thre main components are:

 

- Intel Core i5 3570 3.4Ghz

- 8 GB RAM

- GTX 660 2GB