Bad Tree Pop In With Veydogolt Trees

[mooit]

Hi,

I made at post originally over at Nexusmods, but z929669 said this is not this mod's issue that It's other factors in my setup.

I followed the Step guide and I have the default BethINI and DynDOLOD settings.

But, besides the Step BethINI guide, should I actually adjust the trees from this guide?

https://stepmodifications.org/wiki/Guide:Skyrim_Tree_Settings

Fast Forward and start at 40 seconds, Vimeo for some reason has the video looking pretty choppy, so just start it from there.

Here's the video;

https://vimeo.com/user99539529

THANKS

Edited May 31, 2023 by mooit

[mooit]

Either I need a new pair of glasses, or I'm forgetting, other settings to change...

OK...

After posting, I followed the tree guide I posted above.

https://stepmodifications.org/wiki/Guide:Skyrim_Tree_Settings

Now, the trees look a lot better, and I assume what I am now seeing is the normal look of some pop in.

https://vimeo.com/831702802

P.S. Maybe the Tree guide should be linked to the SSE Step Guide, yes?

Edited May 31, 2023 by mooit

[DoubleYou]

Trees use a skinning method in full cells to make trees in the distance potentially more performance friendly, and only fully skinned when up close. The Step INI settings will give you correct tree skinning settings, so it shouldn't be necessary to link to that guide. The relevant BethINI setting is "Tree Detail Fade," as well as "Dynamic Trees" and "Skinned Trees," which are explained in the tooltips as well as in that guide.

[mooit]

14 minutes ago, DoubleYou said:

Trees use a skinning method in full cells to make trees in the distance potentially more performance friendly, and only fully skinned when up close. The Step INI settings will give you correct tree skinning settings, so it shouldn't be necessary to link to that guide. The relevant BethINI setting is "Tree Detail Fade," as well as "Dynamic Trees" and "Skinned Trees," which are explained in the tooltips as well as in that guide.

I have to change these settings, or else I get the bad pop in like the first video.  That is why I mentioned linking  the tree guide to the SSE Step Guide.

[Display]
fMeshLODLevel1FadeTreeDistance=12288
fMeshLODLevel2FadeTreeDistance=16384
fTreesMidLODSwitchDist=16384

But this time I left this back on 120, and when I went back and checked the trees, riding up to them like the second video I could barely see the trees fading in. So I don't know if going from 200 to 120 helped, but it seemed like it had an effect...

[Trees]
uiMaxSkinnedTreesToRender=120

Edited May 31, 2023 by mooit

[DoubleYou]

It sounds like the mod's trees are not skinned appropriately, so by setting it that high it will effectively hide the issue. Setting "Tree Detail Fade" to BethINI Ultra will also work. uiMaxSkinnedTreesToRender sets the maximum number of skinned trees, so you would simply need to set it high so that all trees have full details.

No idea where/how many trees would be max, but I suspect that it is very difficult to find a location with more than 120 trees.

[z929669]

37 minutes ago, mooit said:

I have to change these settings, or else I get the bad pop in like the first video.  That is why I mentioned linking  the tree guide to the SSE Step Guide.

[Display]
fMeshLODLevel1FadeTreeDistance=12288
fMeshLODLevel2FadeTreeDistance=16384
fTreesMidLODSwitchDist=16384

But this time I left this back on 120, and when I went back and checked the trees, riding up to them like the second video I could barely see the trees fading in. So I don't know if going from 200 to 120 helped, but it seemed like it had an effect...

[Trees]
uiMaxSkinnedTreesToRender=120

So you didn't change DynDOLOD at all but only these INI settings to fix it?

As DY mentioned, Using BethINI ensures the settings are (with Ultra settings):
 

[Display]
fMeshLODLevel1FadeTreeDistance=12288
fMeshLODLevel2FadeTreeDistance=16384
fTreesMidLODSwitchDist=16384

[Trees]
uiMaxSkinnedTreesToRender=200

These settings should be proportionate when using BNethINI High/Medium/Low settings.

The only reason a lower setting for uiMaxSkinnedTreesToRender might cause the strange trunk/leaves pop-in is if you are at the max draw calls your hardware can handle, and a lower value throttles this to a range you can handle with your setup.

Remember that Veydogolt Trees are relatively demanding with many more triangles (and draw calls) than most other tree mods. With your fully-modded setup, your draw calls are probably quite high with DynDOLOD, so even a really powerful system can be brought to its knees. We resolve a lot of this with our Performance Tuning advice in the Step SSE guide. You should try following that advice maybe (in terms of ENB and DynDOLOD)

EDIT: DY

... he makes a good point that most points on the map don't include 120+ trees, but it really depends on your uGridsToLoad setting, which should be 5. If you are higher than that, the loaded area will definitely exceed 120 trees, especially if you are also running Veydogolt - Extra Trees. Even at uGids=5 you can exceed this in Falkreath and several other other areas.

Another possibility is the game itself being a bit buggy. Sometimes a PC restart and reload of an area or relaunch of the game can fix these things (due to hardware/software stuff)

[mooit]

What are the BethINI Ultra Tree Detail Fade settings, so I can just adjust only those? I was assuming, because the Step Guide only mentions using BethINI High settings, so I never changed anything from the Guide from High for my setup.

@z929669

I didn't run DynDOLOD over, I only changed those settings, but later put the uiMaxSkinnedTreesToRender back to 120.

THANKS

P.S. I'm all for proportionate and balanced, but at times, I do think there might be some need for individual tweaking to balance out various setups. Like High isn't enough, but going Ultra is to much, so you balance the middle ground between them.

Edited May 31, 2023 by mooit

[z929669]

8 minutes ago, mooit said:

What are the BethINI Ultra Tree Detail Fade settings, so I can just adjust only those? I was assuming, because the Step Guide only mentions using BethINI High settings, so I never changed anything from the Guide from High for my setup.

@z929669

I didn't run DynDOLOD over, I only changed those settings, but later put the uiMaxSkinnedTreesToRender back to 120.

THANKS

There's no way to only impact trees from a given mod using the global game INI settings.

FYI: I run BethINI on Ultra rather than High. It's definitely better for visuals if you have a powerful rig (which I do, see sig), but it comes at the price of the game being unplayable in certain conditions. I just don't care, since I don't play much aside from situational testing.

Because I run at QDR resolution (2560x1440), even my system averages only about 40-50 FPS with Step SSE ... in some areas, I max at maybe like 20-30 FPS.

I'm not upgrading my GPU to a higher tier until prices are way down from current. I just can justify spending $900+ as a matter of principle.

[DoubleYou]

22 minutes ago, mooit said:

What are the BethINI Ultra Tree Detail Fade settings, so I can just adjust only those? I was assuming, because the Step Guide only mentions using BethINI High settings, so I never changed anything from the Guide from High for my setup.

@z929669

I didn't run DynDOLOD over, I only changed those settings, but later put the uiMaxSkinnedTreesToRender back to 120.

THANKS

P.S. I'm all for proportionate and balanced, but at times, I do think there might be some need for individual tweaking to balance out various setups. Like High isn't enough, but going Ultra is to much, so you balance the middle ground between them.

@z929669 posted the BethINI Ultra values:

[Display]
fMeshLODLevel1FadeTreeDistance=12288
fMeshLODLevel2FadeTreeDistance=16384
fTreesMidLODSwitchDist=16384

[Trees]
uiMaxSkinnedTreesToRender=200

 

[mooit]

@ z929669

I'm not following what you mean?

There's no way to only impact trees from a given mod using the global game INI settings.

@DoubleYou

Ok on those settings

I just built a new gaming box 8 months ago with a EVGA FTW3 Ultra 3080 and really happy with it, don't plan on any new parts/upgrades anytime soon here.

THANKS

P.S. I just posted my Specs in my Signature...

 

Edited May 31, 2023 by mooit

[mooit]

While we are on the subject of Fade Distances, and instead of posting a new post, what are the Ultra Grass settings for BethINI, can someone please post those too?

THANKS

[z929669]

13 minutes ago, mooit said:

@ z929669

I'm not following what you mean?

There's no way to only impact trees from a given mod using the global game INI settings.

I misread your question for some reason. Ignore that statement

7 minutes ago, mooit said:

While we are on the subject of Fade Distances, and instead of posting a new post, what are the Ultra Grass settings for BethINI, can someone please post those too?

THANKS

Just run BethINI and look. The settings from your current config are backed up by BethINI, so you can easily restore them.

%LOCALAPPDATA%\ModOrganizer\{instanceName}\profiles\{profileName}\BethINI Cache\YYYY DDD MMM DD - HH.MM.SS

[DoubleYou]

18 minutes ago, mooit said:

While we are on the subject of Fade Distances, and instead of posting a new post, what are the Ultra Grass settings for BethINI, can someone please post those too?

THANKS

Ultra grass settings are same as on the Grass LOD Guide, ensuring grass is rendered to maximum distance.

You can easily see what the preset values are for BethINI in the Presets folder within your BethINI installation. These are the only settings applied when using the poor/low/medium/high/ultra preset buttons.

[z929669]

46 minutes ago, mooit said:

While we are on the subject of Fade Distances, and instead of posting a new post, what are the Ultra Grass settings for BethINI, can someone please post those too?

THANKS

For the record: Posting questions separately is beneficial and encouraged, especially for straight-forward, singular questions like this. They go into a Q&A forum just like this one. Then you as the poster are expected to mark the "best answer", which bubbles that post to the top just beneath your question. This makes it easy for others to find answers to a similar questions both here and from the internet.

Normal forum icon:

Q&A (support) forum icon:

 

This question ideally would have been posted in the BethINI Support forum.

[mooit]

Ok thanks guys!