stuck large reference lod in classic

[jdsmith2816]

Greetings peoples.

 

I've recently run into an issue where my Whiterun large lods, the ones tll doesn't turn off, won't unload.  I've done some testing on my end and after speaking with some other people it was suggested it is due to my whiterun interior being larger than the exterior.

 

Has anyone run into this particular situation?

 

Thanks in advance!

[sheson]

There is no such thing as "large references" in Skyrim. Models that stay after typing tll are neverfades / Is Full LOD.

There is no such thing as a Whiterun "Interior". There is a Whiterun "exterior" worldspace that uses Tamriel as parent for LOD and other things. Its size is irrelevant.

 

This looks like FAQ: Skyrim: Out of place objects / flickering full models

Edited January 23, 2017 by sheson

[jdsmith2816]

This is on a fresh game, simply choosing "New Game" and then using tmm 1 w/ fast travel or coc to whiterun from main menu...   I tried both since I thought that maybe coc from main menu wasn't giving dyndolod time to initialize and it was somehow causing issues.

 

Maybe I'm using the wrong terminology but the only lods affected are the ones for the large structures that don't disappear when you type tll into the console... The guard towers, walls, etc.

 

It was suggested to me that the interior of whiterun being larger than the exterior of whiterun was somehow related but if that's not the case then great.  You obviously know more than anyone else on this topic :D

 

I've thoroughly read the FAQ and common troubleshooting steps and have been using dyndolod since it was released.  I think this is an uncommon situation.

Edited January 23, 2017 by jdsmith2816

[dunc001]

Just thought I'd chip in here as I'm testing exactly the same loadout as JD and have exactly the same LOD issues as he's having. Funnily enough following on from the last issue you helped me with in the main DynDOLOD thread there is also a floating rock in the sky above Bleakwind. Weird thing is, this time the is nothing in any plugin in 0,0 (only two disabled cabbages :P ), the FormID I get when I console it relates only to DynDOLOD.esp. other than that there are sticking LODs for walls, rooves, and ground in the areas directly outside the city walls. I've run DynDOLOD with Temporary=1, makes no difference. What should we be checking?

Edited January 24, 2017 by dunc001

[sheson]

This is on a fresh game, simply choosing "New Game" and then using tmm 1 w/ fast travel or coc to whiterun from main menu...   I tried both since I thought that maybe coc from main menu wasn't giving dyndolod time to initialize and it was somehow causing issues.

 

Maybe I'm using the wrong terminology but the only lods affected are the ones for the large structures that don't disappear when you type tll into the console... The guard towers, walls, etc.

 

It was suggested to me that the interior of whiterun being larger than the exterior of whiterun was somehow related but if that's not the case then great.  You obviously know more than anyone else on this topic :D

 

I've thoroughly read the FAQ and common troubleshooting steps and have been using dyndolod since it was released.  I think this is an uncommon situation.

 

If this is a fresh game, then I wonder if you are using Open Cities and followed the instructions correctly.

 

Please post a screenshot, maybe load order. Almost none of the Whiterun buildings should be neverfades and almost none should be visible when turning off LOD.

 

 

Just thought I'd chip in here as I'm testing exactly the same loadout as JD and have exactly the same LOD issues as he's having. Funnily enough following on from the last issue you helped me with in the main DynDOLOD thread there is also a floating rock in the sky above Bleakwind. Weird thing is, this time the is nothing in any plugin in 0,0 (only two disabled cabbages :P ), the FormID I get when I console it relates only to DynDOLOD.esp. other than that there are sticking LODs for walls, rooves, and ground in the areas directly outside the city walls. I've run DynDOLOD with Temporary=1, makes no difference. What should we be checking?

You should provide a proper error report. What loadout are we talking about here?

 

DynDOLOD does not add random references in the middle of the map. Carelessly created mods do.

 

 

 

The FormID I get when I console it relates only to DynDOLOD.esp

 

 

What does "relates to DynDOLOD.esp" mean?

 

Either the reference is added by DynDOLOD or not. Check the reference in xEdit. If it is added by DynDOLOD, check its Editor ID. It will have the source mod name and form id.

 

If LOD is sticking around, it can either be dynamic LOD with Form IDs (stays visible in LOD area with tll) or static that has no Form ID (it goes away with tll).

 

If it is the latter then the problem is a borked setup, bad INIs, memory problems.

Edited January 24, 2017 by sheson

[jdsmith2816]

If this is a fresh game, then I wonder if you are using Open Cities and followed the instructions correctly.

 

Please post a screenshot, maybe load order. Almost none of the Whiterun buildings should be neverfades and almost none should be visible when turning off LOD.

 

Screenshots of the issue can be found here

 

I've used tll at tha tpoint and show before/after disabling on two of the stuck lods.

 

Only thing loaded consists of:

Skyrim

Update

Dawnguard

HearthFires

Dragonborn

USLEEP

Merge Resources esm

DDL Addons merge (DesyncBirdsOfPrey, HighHrothgarWindowGlow)

Skyrim Exteriors Merge

DynDOLOD.esp

 

Upon looking those records up in xedit the record in DDL is a visible when distant REFR named WRWallGateTarTrap01_DynDOLOD_LOD [sTAT:0900144B] and the editor id leads me to a Visible when distant REFR in my merge.. NAME of WRWallGateTarTrap01[sTAT: 00042515]

 

The WRWallGateTarTrap01 is part of Skyrim.esm is not overridden and should appear as it does in your Skyrim.esm Has Distant LOD w/ 3 LOD nif's attached

 

The merge mentioned is a giant skyrim overhaul I'm working on with a couple other people and is not available publicly.  What sort of things should I look at in the modifications to these structures that could trigger the stuck lods?

 

I'm generally fine figuring these sorts of things out on my own but in this case I just don't know enough to even properly ask the right questions...

Edited January 24, 2017 by jdsmith2816

[sheson]

Screenshots of the issue can be found here

 

I've used tll at tha tpoint and show before/after disabling on two of the stuck lods.

 

Only thing loaded consists of:

Skyrim

Update

Dawnguard

HearthFires

Dragonborn

USLEEP

Merge Resources esm

DDL Addons merge (DesyncBirdsOfPrey, HighHrothgarWindowGlow)

Skyrim Exteriors Merge

DynDOLOD.esp

 

Upon looking those records up in xedit the record in DDL is a visible when distant REFR named WRWallGateTarTrap01_DynDOLOD_LOD [sTAT:0900144B] and the editor id leads me to a Visible when distant REFR in my merge.. NAME of WRWallGateTarTrap01[sTAT: 00042515]

 

The WRWallGateTarTrap01 is part of Skyrim.esm is not overridden and should appear as it does in your Skyrim.esm Has Distant LOD w/ 3 LOD nif's attached

 

The merge mentioned is a giant skyrim overhaul I'm working on with a couple other people and is not available publicly.  What sort of things should I look at in the modifications to these structures that could trigger the stuck lods?

 

I'm generally fine figuring these sorts of things out on my own but in this case I just don't know enough to even properly ask the right questions...

 

So there is an incompatible mod in the load order. Kind of important detail   

 

If a mod adds new references (for which LOD models or mesh rules exist) into the exterior child worldspace Whiterun it may need custom rules/ini settings to correctly deal with the automatic additions to the exterior parent worldspace Tamriel.

 

The solution depends if the object is added to the child or parent worldspace, or if two objects are added to both. If you send me sample plugin with just a couple objects in questions I can have a look what the best course of action is.

[Sacralletius]

I'm also helping out with that Skyrim overhaul. As for Whiterun, I added objects in the "WhiterunWorld" worldspace and the "Tamriel" Worldspace near Whiterun.

 

I haven't tested this myself, but I'm pretty sure that the WhiterunWorld exterior cells exceeds the related Tamriel cells, as I made the WhiterunWorld Worldspace a lot bigger.

 

I'll do some more testing and I'll let you know what I find out.

Edited January 24, 2017 by Sacralletius

[sheson]

 

 

I haven't tested this myself, but I'm pretty sure that the WhiterunWorld exterior cells exceeds the related Tamriel cells, as I made the WhiterunWorld Worldspace a lot bigger.

That would mean the mod adds cells to WhiterunWorld that are outside of Tamriel. When the player is in the child world, its temporary cells simply replace the temporary cells of the parent world with the same coordinates. Maybe what you mean is, that the mod adds new cells to the Whiterun worldspace that aren't in Skyrim.esm.

 

In any case all of that does not matter for DynDOLODs LOD generation or that plugins which add objects to child worlds often need settings for compatibility.

Edited January 24, 2017 by sheson

[Sacralletius]

In WhiterunWorld (= Child Worldspace?): I added a lot of new buildings. I also move the east walls a bit further out to make room for the buildings

 

In Tamriel (= Parent Worldspace?): I added a new district and an entrance to the east wall (the wall that corresponds with the one I moved in WhiterunWorld, but I didn't move it in Tamriel.)

 

So the size of the city in WhiterunWorld doesn't correspond exactly with the size of the city in Tamriel. I hope that makes sense. I'm a bit bad at explaining.

Edited January 24, 2017 by Sacralletius

[dunc001]

That would explain the 'overlap' I had when exiting through that east wall door and ending up with LOD walls and rooves all around me. Presumably they are LODs for the buildings added in the child workspace in that expanded area? I'll try and upload some screenshots shortly.

Edited January 24, 2017 by dunc001

[sheson]

In WhiterunWorld (= Child Worldspace?): I added a lot of new buildings. I also move the east walls a bit further out to make room for the buildings

 

In Tamriel (= Parent Worldspace?): I added a new district and an entrance to the east wall (the wall that corresponds with the one I moved in WhiterunWorld, but I didn't move it in Tamriel.)

 

So the size of the city in WhiterunWorld doesn't correspond exactly with the size of the city in Tamriel. I hope that makes sense. I'm a bit bad at explaining.

Yes, WhiterunWorld is a child worldspace of Tamriel. WhiterunWorld uses Tamriel for Land, LOD, Climate and Sky Cell.

 

When the player is in the childworld each of its cell replaces currently loaded 5x5 cells of the parent worldspace, whatever is past those cells is LOD from the parent world.

 

Any mod that makes changes to the child world should also make the same changes to the parent world so the views from inside/outside match. Since this is how the vanilla game was designed, DynDOLOD automatically finds objects which are LOD worthy in the child worlds and makes a LOD replica in the parent world.

 

If a mod makes extensive changes the child world without caring about the parent world, there are several ways to tell DynDOLOD how to deal with the entire mod or with the new references it adds. See next post.

 

Until the compatibility info is added to the DynDOLODs INIs/rules it is best to simply do not load such incompatible mods when generating LOD.

Edited January 24, 2017 by sheson

[sheson]

DynDOLOD will not add a replica to the parent world if there already exist a "copy" of the same model at the same postion/rotation. In all other cases:

 

If everything the mod adds should be ignored for LOD, add the distinctive part of the filename to ..\DynDOLOD\Edit Scripts\DynDOLOD\DynDOLOD_TES5.ini IgnoreModFileName= list.

 

If only new objects added to a childworld should be ignored for LOD, add the plugin.esp name and the worldspace name list to ..\DynDOLOD\Edit Scripts\DynDOLOD\DynDOLOD_TES5_mod_world_ignore.txt

Use this if the mod also adds new objects in Tamriel which should have LOD.

 

If only a handful selective references in a childworld need to be ignored, they can be added as plugin.esp;[ref-formid] to ..\DynDOLOD\Edit Scripts\DynDOLOD\DynDOLOD_TES5_childworldlod_Tamriel.txt

Use this if LOD is mostly OK and only a few objects are out of place or otherwise do not need to have LOD.

 

If the replica is basically correct but could be a full model instead (for very large objects this happens automatically), add the plugin.esp;[ref-formid] to ..\DynDOLOD\Edit Scripts\DynDOLOD\DynDOLOD_TES5_childworldfull.txt

 

If this mod is publicly released let me know so I can add any rules to the next version of DynDOLOD.

Edited January 24, 2017 by sheson

[Sacralletius]

Thanks, I'll try this.